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Possession and Personality, Could Ginny's possession in COS affect Deathly Hallows outcome?

DorisTLC View Member Profile	Feb 16 2007, 08:38 PM Post #1
Waiting for Wednesdays Posts: 8,745 Joined: 7:57am January 28, 2005 Location: Hiding from Hurricanes	In this book, we find that Harry is a Parselmouth. He learns from Dumbledore that this rare gift has probably been passed to him when the curse rebounded and left his with his scar. QUOTE Dumbledore: "Unless I'm much mistaken, he transferred some of his own powers to you the night he gave you that scar. Not something he intended to do, I'm sure...." (CS18) If LV is able to pass a gift to Harry through a scar curse, (COS) what could he have passed to Ginny while she was possessed by Tom Riddle from the Diary? QUOTE "I didn't want anyone to talk to me," said Harry, who was feeling more and more nettled. "Well, that was a bit stupid of you," said Ginny angrily, "seeing as you don't know anyone but me who's been possessed by You-Know-Who, and I can tell you how it feels." Harry remained quite still as the impact of these words hit him. Then he wheeled around. "I forgot," he said. "Lucky you," said Ginny coolly. (OP23) Ginny was very meek when we first met her in COS. She hid when Harry was around, yet we hear from her brothers that she talks quite a lot about Harry. In POA we see that she seems more embarrased around Harry, in OoTP, even Fred and George are impressed with her abilities. In COS we see that she's seemingly more embarrased to be around Harry... QUOTE Ginny, who had always been very taken with Harry, seemed even more heartily embarrassed than usual when she saw him, perhaps because he had saved her life during their previous year at Hogwarts. She went very red and muttered "hello" without looking at him. Percy, however, held out his hand solemnly as though he and Harry had never met and said, "Harry. How nice to see you." (PoA page 4 ) We'll have to look into all of the books in this series to see if this event is a catalyst of change in her personality. Any outside research in possession in mythology (particularly Celtic mythology) might be of a great help as well. If Harry received such a rare gift when touched by a curse, is it possible that Ginny was also left with some traits from Tom Riddle after her possession? How have we seen this manifested in Ginny's personality? How could this affect the outcome of Deathly Hallows? This post has been edited by DorisTLC: Feb 16 2007, 09:01 PM -------------------- avatar by The Rockin Leaky Staff

who2 View Member Profile	Feb 16 2007, 09:19 PM Post #2
Being Eaten by the Pea Soup Posts: 38 Joined: 10:35am February 9, 2007	I see your point, her character drastically changed infront of Harry after COS. However, Ginny skilled in Quidditch and perhaps the bat-like curse has no connection with LV. The only change I see from her is that she is able to control her feelings for Harry and able to confront him, which makes sense as your mind instinctively grows stronger after being possessed.

WaggaWaggaWerewo... WaggaWaggaWerewolf View Member Profile	Feb 16 2007, 10:03 PM Post #3
Madame Pince's House Elf Posts: 4,111 Joined: 5:46pm January 28, 2005 Location: Telephone box, Wagga Wagga	QUOTE(DorisTLC @ Feb 17 2007, 11:38 AM) [snapback]1104622[/snapback] If Harry received such a rare gift (as parseltongue) when touched by a curse, is it possible that Ginny was also left with some traits from Tom Riddle after her possession? How have we seen this manifested in Ginny's personality? How could this affect the outcome of Deathly Hallows? In COS Dumbledore compares the likenesses between Tom Riddle and Harry. As well as Parseltongue, according to Dumbledore (p. 245 CS), Harry has 'many qualities Salazar Slytherin prized in his hand-picked students. His own very rare gift, Parseltongue....resourcefulness....determination......a certain disregard for the rules' I think as a result of her possession that much of the same could be said of Ginny as well. I ought to have said beforehand that one symptom of her dealings with Tom Riddle was probably her calling LV 'The Dark Lord' in her Valentine to Harry, since we learn that only DE's call him that. QUOTE "I didn't want anyone to talk to me," said Harry, who was feeling more and more nettled. "Well, that was a bit stupid of you," said Ginny angrily, "seeing as you don't know anyone but me who's been possessed by You-Know-Who, and I can tell you how it feels." Harry remained quite still as the impact of these words hit him. Then he wheeled around. "I forgot," he said. "Lucky you," said Ginny coolly. (OP23) The possession, itself, has left her with memories not only in the above passage you quoted from OP, but also when she queried Harry having the Half-Blood Prince second-hand potions book. Ginny did take Hermione's advice and make friends elsewhere, but throughout these dates it seems she kept her emotional involvement with Harry undiminished. Stephen Fry's audiobook of HBP has Ginny firstly commenting about meeting Dean with great enthusiasm, then later on with a more matter-of-fact tone, then lastly, before their split, sounding a bit disgruntled and unenthusiastic. I agree that Ginny was very meek when we first met her in COS. So was Quirrell when we first met him in PS/SS. Quirrell undoubtedly suffered under LV's administration, and I am sure that Ginny did also. However, Quirrell, when Harry met him in front of the Mirror, dropped his pretence of being poor and stuttering. Ginny, by OOTP, seemed to show the same reversal of personality, though, unlike Quirrell, this was involuntary, and also a reaction against bossy big brothers. She had taken Hermione's advice, but the Big Brother reaction was to be suspicious of any involvement with the opposite sex. It is just this big brother attitude held by Fred and George, not only Ron, which gave Harry pause to reconsider and to worry about what Ron would think in HBP. I could understand Ginny's embarrassment in POA, and also her fear of expulsion because of the diary possessing her previously in COS. But by OOTP, as you say, even Fred and George are impressed with her abilities. Ginny seemed to also have a certain disregard for the rules, resourcefulness and determination as witness her taking out her brothers' brooms in turn for Quidditch practice when excluded from the brotherly bonding sessions. It was Ginny who helped plan the diversion which allowed Harry to have that last talk to Sirius and Lupin. And it was Ginny who got Ron, Neville and Luna away from Malfoy in Umbridge's office. There are the unblushing lies to her mother about Crookshanks and dungbombs, while helping to spy on the Order of the Phoenix, plus her hitting the commentator's box in the first HPB Quidditch game. I think that Ginny might present a danger in Deathly Hallows, either because LV uses her to stop Harry or get at him, or else that Ginny has learned how resist and to stand up for herself and won't fall for it. Harry fears Ginny's vulnerability at the end of Deathly Hallows. Maybe he should also fear that LV might try to possess her again, or has left traces of himself inside her. This post has been edited by WaggaWaggaWerewolf: Feb 16 2007, 10:18 PM -------------------- OotP Book Club

Lomelindi View Member Profile	Feb 16 2007, 10:44 PM Post #4
Cauldron Bottom Measurer Posts: 114 Joined: 12:08am November 23, 2006 Location: Canada	I rather doubt that LV passed any actual abilities or traits onto Ginny, but I do agree that he affected her. I think that the change in her personality, the emergence of boldness, comes simply from the fact that she was possessed. I don't think she necessarily needed to be possessed by LV to become stronger or braver. I think that just comes naturally after being through a tough, unusual experience. She's on her guard now, because she doesn't want anything like it to happen again. So yes, technically that could be LV's fault, but he didn't exactly pass along powers to her. -------------------- .•¨¯¨•.¸Lomelindi.•¨¯¨•.¸

SoonerGryffindor View Member Profile	Feb 17 2007, 01:24 AM Post #5
WeasleyCast's Hostess With The Mostest Posts: 6,606 Joined: 2:44am February 20, 2006 Location: At The Burrow taking cooking lessons from Molly	I do wonder if maybe there is some....thing that passed to Ginny from her year of being exposed to Tom Riddle's soul fraction. I am not thinking in terms of the ability to speak parseltongue, or the scar connection, but maybe she now has some built-in protection against being possessed or maybe she is hyper-sensitive to Tom's magic now. I can't help but think there was something to the fact that Ginny seemed affected by the veil in the Department of Mysteries in OotP, although she seemed to be affected in a different way than Harry. We know that she has not seen anyone die, because she could not see the thestrals. I think that her journey to the underworld via Tom's diary has given her something intangible that may come into play in DH. -------------------- This Episode is so big, we needed Hermione's beaded bag WeasleyCast.Com

Snark View Member Profile	Feb 17 2007, 01:57 AM Post #6
Knight Bus Driver in Training Posts: 600 Joined: 11:58pm December 4, 2006 Location: Alberta!	I think Tom Riddle robbed Ginny of her innocence and probably made it hard for her really trust those outside her 'family.' I agree that the possession did not change her fundamental temperment, but probably left her more guarded and caused her to 'grow up' more quickly than the 'baby of the family' would be otherwise inclined. I'm not sure if there's any magical mark left behind though. She may have information that she doesn't realize she has, and I wonder if some of her worst memories haven't been altered by Dumbledore. -------------------- 'Now, we'll go upstairs really quietly, and wait for Mum to call us for breakfast. Then, Ron, you come bounding down the stairs going, "Mum, look who turned up in the night!" and she'll be all pleased to see Harry and no one need ever know we flew the car.'

Praxagora View Member Profile	Feb 17 2007, 02:10 PM Post #7
Firebolt-Polisher at Quality Quidditch Supplies Posts: 1,085 Joined: 4:32pm October 12, 2005 Location: Norway	QUOTE(SoonerGryffindor @ Feb 17 2007, 07:24 AM) [snapback]1104852[/snapback] I do wonder if maybe there is some....thing that passed to Ginny from her year of being exposed to Tom Riddle's soul fraction. I am not thinking in terms of the ability to speak parseltongue, or the scar connection, but maybe she now has some built-in protection against being possessed or maybe she is hyper-sensitive to Tom's magic now. I can't help but think there was something to the fact that Ginny seemed affected by the veil in the Department of Mysteries in OotP, although she seemed to be affected in a different way than Harry. We know that she has not seen anyone die, because she could not see the thestrals. I think that her journey to the underworld via Tom's diary has given her something intangible that may come into play in DH. Great point SoonerGryffindor I wondered about Ginny and the veil.. About the change of personality, I'm not sure whether she changed so much per se during the years. In the fifth year we see Ginny as outspoken and spunky, but I think this is just because she is finally letting Harry see that side of her. Remember when she is very shy at the Burrow when Harry meets her Ron (I think) says how weird it it seing her like that since she normally wont shut up So her personality has a natural development and is not the result of that diary, at least that's what I think. But I really liked Sooners thoughts -------------------- "Music is a moral law. It gives soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination, and charm and gaiety to life and to everything" (Plato)

Velse View Member Profile	Feb 17 2007, 05:02 PM Post #8
Eeylops Owl Cage Cleaner Posts: 235 Joined: 12:36pm October 25, 2006 Location: New Jersey	Wouldn't the possessed Ginny have had to use Parseltongue to get into the Chamber? I've been wondering if she might have retained this ability, partly because I'm betting on a Chamber scene in DH. On the other hand, Ginny had no memory of the time she spent possessed, so maybe not. I don't have a clear idea of what being possessed entails, exactly, and you don't get much explanation in CoS (just "go have a cup of chocolate, Ginny"--I thought that was a truly bizarre resolution, personally). Hmm. -------------------- How will you learn if you don't read Scribbulus? Emily and Nina

Snark View Member Profile	Feb 17 2007, 05:31 PM Post #9
Knight Bus Driver in Training Posts: 600 Joined: 11:58pm December 4, 2006 Location: Alberta!	QUOTE On the other hand, Ginny had no memory of the time she spent possessed, so maybe not. I don't have a clear idea of what being possessed entails, exactly, and you don't get much explanation in CoS (just "go have a cup of chocolate, Ginny"--I thought that was a truly bizarre resolution, personally). I wonder (and I mentioned on another thread) if some of Ginny's more harrowing memories haven't been altered. We know for certain (well, it is Riddle's version, so, maybe not) that she fought at least once (down in the Chamber), that she stopped trusting the diary, and I can't imagine why she would have disposed of it in Moaning Myrtle's bathroom unless Riddle had her down there -- possessed -- when she broke free and flushed it. And we know that Riddle was very very angry when she stole the diary back. Somehow, I doubt a cup of cocoa would do the trick here. -------------------- 'Now, we'll go upstairs really quietly, and wait for Mum to call us for breakfast. Then, Ron, you come bounding down the stairs going, "Mum, look who turned up in the night!" and she'll be all pleased to see Harry and no one need ever know we flew the car.'

MysteryloverAnne View Member Profile	Feb 17 2007, 06:09 PM Post #10
Slug and Jiggers' Apothecary Apprentice Posts: 1,417 Joined: 8:49pm December 9, 2006 Location: Lost in a Good Book somewhere in Minneapolis	I would like the idea that somehow some knowledge she gained while being possessed could be helpful to Harry in DH, but up til now I haven't noticed any evidence of that. I believe Ginny felt very deeply and very strongly the horror of what happened to her and found the inner strength to overcome that rather than let it destroy her. I think that is what lead to her great leap in maturity and her determination to forge her own way through life. -------------------- avatar by theonlysong Siggy by Kendra.Dumbledore