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Alchemy In Harry Potter, Part 7: The series is now complete |
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 Jul 23 2007, 07:11 AM
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Organizing the Halo Rebellion
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Now that Deathly Hallows is finished, it is time for us to begin a new journey with the Alchemy thread: part 7. All the pieces are laid out. Let's analyze!
Here is the previous Alchemy discussion.
Fawkes28
LL Mod
This post has been edited by fawkes28: Jul 23 2007, 07:15 AM
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Jul 23 2007, 11:20 AM
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Stargazing on the Astronomy Tower
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I find it amusing that this is part 7 incarnation of this thread. 
[spoiler]Anyways I've been told that our Red Stage was in fact Rufus Scrimjeor, it seems from Harry's POV that Scrim gave his life to Harry and didn't rat on him. So my hats off to him.
I also wonder now if it was Tonks and Lupin that were the White/Red because they were the ones that got married first and with child first, is Teddy the golden child?
I believe that Harry actually did become the Master of death, for about the length of his discussion with Dumbledore, it would make sense to me that he saw DD because he had the ressurection stone. All the Hallows were together, imo, Harry had the cloak and stone while LV had the wand. So when he let go of all that, he became "Normal" he wanted to live his normal life with Ginny.  [/spoiler]
I wonder now if the Philospher's stone was just a red herring? Considering the importance of the Hallows.
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Jul 23 2007, 01:27 PM
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Shopping for a New Firebolt
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New to this topic, and only got through the first page of the last Alchemy thread, so I hope I'm not repeating anything. This response got pretty long, so I broke it down into two parts. 
As the opening quote on the last thread, it mentioned that the Chemical Wedding between Bill and Fleur was surprising. I always found that Fleur's name was very interesting in itself. Fleur's name: Fleur Delacour, means Flower of the Court (perhaps a reference to the Fleur De Lis in the French coat of arms?), according to JKR. Interestingly enough, change the spelling slightly to add an "e" between O and U making it Delacoeur, makes the translation to roughly read: Flower of the Heart, which refers to the realized soul aspect in alchemy. The word "coeur" (heart) is masculine which would represent the groom in the wedding party, but the soul aspect is the bride. When Bill (material aspect) was transformed physically by the werewolf, Fleur had already "captured" his heart and knew who he really was, so his physical transformation, no matter how "ugly" would mean nothing to her, since she was already "at home" in his heart.
Names have often been changed purposefully and unintentionally through the generations due to a variety of reasons, including when the significance of a name is lost, or when holding a certain name would likely cause trouble. In Fleur's case, she has her father's surname, but her Veela heritage was through her maternal grandmother. It seems that this might be some sort of indication that her heritage might bear some resemblance to a Grail quest.
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Jul 23 2007, 01:31 PM
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Shopping for a New Firebolt
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I did a little more research on Beauxbatons which brought me a little closer to the alchemy connection between Bill and Fleur. The school had no suits of armor, but statues of ice which flanked the halls. A "cold heart" can prevent the soul from shining through, which would offer protection to the school and its inhabitants - if you can't see or feel what you are missing, a treasure would not be recognized for what it is. Madame Maxime is a formidable guardian of her charges, but in her interaction with Hagrid, we see the matching soul blossom to his open and trusting heart. When the students are outside of the school, they are perceived by men to be irresistable, but seem cold and aloof to other women, and other females feel threatened by their presence. Why might that be? In alchemical terms, the material (male) aspect is always in search of its soul (female) aspect. The Veelas are "pure soul" so to speak, so they hold an unbridled attraction to any male. Every female has a bit of "Veela" in her, but in varying amounts which might not always be so obviously present to the males that interact with her on a regular basis. The jealousy that Mrs Weasley and Ginny regard Fleur with by calling her "Phlegm" is merely a misunderstanding that because of Fleur's beauty, she could not be faithful to Bill. The Veelas had a reputation of "loving and leaving" unsuspecting men, which might be true or untrue. It isn't until Bill's handsome features are lost, and Fleur stays true and defends her committment, that Mrs Weasley finally sees the real love that binds her son and his fiance, and is able to accept and rejoice in it.
The wedding scene when Fleur is walking down the aisle with her father, she shares the glow and beauty of her happiness with every other person present: "While her radiance usually dimmed everyone else by comparison, today it beautified everybody it fell upon. Ginny and Gabrielle, both wearing golden dresses, looked even prettier than usual, and once Fleur had reached him, Bill did not look as though he had ever met Fenrir Greyback" [ Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, Scholastic, p.144] The golden dresses, and the golden "sun" robes worn by Luna and her father, also represent this transformation into something untainted, pure and "whole".
Fleur's "soul connection" can also be seen later on, when Harry apologizes for all the work she has to do while he is staying at Shell Cottage. She replies "'Arry, you saved my sister's life, I do not forget." [ibid, p510]. She is, of course, referring to the Triwizard Tournament when Harry saved Gabrielle from drowning underneath the lake. The soul is our "memory keeper", and its beauty is determined by and reflects that which it has been able to transform to "good" from "bad". We were never given a real reason why Fleur was not capable of completing that task, but it would seem that a soul cannot save another soul, that is needs a material aspect (in this case Harry) to pull it from the depths. Also note, that she said that Harry saved her sister's life, not her sister. For a soul that hasn't yet been "realized", life is the only way that it can be achieved. Harry saving Gabrielle's life, though it wasn't his task to do so, gave her the opportunity to find her own "heart". As an aside, that Viktor was the one to pull Hermione from her "suspended animation" shows that the beauty of Hermione, which might have been overlooked before, was brought to the surface for all to see, through him.
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Jul 24 2007, 05:04 AM
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PotterWatch Executive Producer
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QUOTE(Pat_Rorrythe @ Jul 23 2007, 09:48 AM) [snapback]1334743[/snapback] Well, Harry has to be seen as a Christ figure hasn't it ? Yung speaks of the lapis-christ, which, following the tradition, the Christ is the hook to catch the Leviathan : see hereLilly was the mother who gave the saviour of HP series. And the snake has fallen in the trap. Yung spoke about it in his analysis of the "aurora consurgens".
I think you're absolutely right... Harry had the potential within him all along to achieve gold, but it didn't happen until he chose to walk into that arena, no weapon in his hand, head held high. He had to choose it. I think that leads right into what memyslfnI was saying about how he appeared at King's Cross, with no scars or glasses -- his perfect form.
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Jul 24 2007, 09:07 AM
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Kibble Boy/Girl at the Magical Menagerie
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QUOTE(momwitch @ Jul 23 2007, 07:19 PM) [snapback]1336665[/snapback] I agree that the wedding was vitally important to the Alchemical elements  to the story. My point was in reference to it being a surprise that it would end up being Bill and Fleur's event. Making the "royal" connection of this union can be further strengthened by the "colors" they embody by merits of their "houses" or schools. Bill was in Gryffindor, making him red and gold. Fleur's "uniform" was blue. Red + Blue = (Royal) Purple One can easily imagine that a joining of these two elements, bound and embroidered with gold thread is highly symbolic.
I agree with M that Ron and Hermione were just too young yet. Bill and Fleur fit the Red King/White Queen motif perfectly. And there are other signs early on in the book that the Royal Marriage would create something big:
p 118
QUOTE Hermione made purple and gold streamers erupt from the end of her wand and drape themselves artistically over the trees and bushes.
"Nice," said Ron, as with one final flourish of her wand, Hermione turned the leaves on the crabapple tree to gold.
And on page 120:
QUOTE "Ar, not bad. Bin busy, we got some newborn unicorns [...]
And as for Lupin and Tonks, they are the Old King/Young Queen. I think that was from the Chemical Wedding?
This post has been edited by Arduinna the Huntress: Jul 24 2007, 09:27 AM
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Jul 24 2007, 10:39 AM
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Director of Nicholas Flamel Laboratories
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QUOTE(Arduinna the Huntress @ Jul 24 2007, 09:07 AM) [snapback]1339554[/snapback] QUOTE(momwitch @ Jul 23 2007, 07:19 PM) [snapback]1336665[/snapback] I agree that the wedding was vitally important to the Alchemical elements to the story. My point was in reference to it being a surprise that it would end up being Bill and Fleur's event. Making the "royal" connection of this union can be further strengthened by the "colors" they embody by merits of their "houses" or schools. Bill was in Gryffindor, making him red and gold. Fleur's "uniform" was blue. Red + Blue = (Royal) Purple One can easily imagine that a joining of these two elements, bound and embroidered with gold thread is highly symbolic. I agree with M that Ron and Hermione were just too young yet. Bill and Fleur fit the Red King/White Queen motif perfectly. And there are other signs early on in the book that the Royal Marriage would create something big: p 118 QUOTE Hermione made purple and gold streamers erupt from the end of her wand and drape themselves artistically over the trees and bushes.
"Nice," said Ron, as with one final flourish of her wand, Hermione turned the leaves on the crabapple tree to gold. And on page 120: QUOTE "Ar, not bad. Bin busy, we got some newborn unicorns [...] And as for Lupin and Tonks, they are the Old King/Young Queen. I think that was from the Chemical Wedding?
And on the wedding cake, there was a pair of phoenixes.
The whole wedding chapters were chock full of seventh stage alchemical rubedo symbolism. Yikes!
I do not believe that Rufus Scrimgeour was the marker for the final stage. His name might mean "red", but 1) he certainly hadn't been with Harry from the beginning and 2) Harry didn't even like him. And 3) we never found anything at all that said Hagrid had to die. We never did.
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You see things; and you say, 'Why?' But I dream things that never were; and I say, "Why not?" --George Bernard Shaw, "Back to Methuselah" (1921), part 1, act 1 |
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