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The Elder Wand, I think Harry is going to be in serious trouble. |
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 Jul 12 2008, 04:12 PM
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Just Through the Brick Wall
Posts: 7
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Location: Finland
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Am I the only one who thinks Harry can't simply leave the Elder Wand to be? The Wand has passed from wizard to wizard for god knows how many hundred years, and every single one of the previous owners has either been murdered or disarmed (and later probably killed by someone else looking for the Wand) by the next one. There had to be others before Harry who simply wanted to hide the Wand and have a natural death to end the bloody cycle, but every time someone has found out and the Wand has kept passing from hand to hand. The Wand always resurfaces, like Ollivander said. I bet there's a some sort of spell that prevents Harry from simply throwing the Wand away. I think that whenever Harry is in danger and has to use his wand the EW appears in his pocket from nowhere, sort of like the Sword of Gryffindor that can be pulled out from the Sorting Hat no matter where the Sword is.
Anyway, sooner or later someone will come to Harry and try to take the Wand, considering that Ollivander was able to guess that Gregorovitch had acquired the Wand after being vanished for centuries, and that Harry and Voldemort were discussing quite openly about the Wand in the Great Hall, althought they didn't mention its name. At the very end of the book Harry had a conversation with Dumbledore's portrait and every Headmaster and Headmistress of Hogwarts was most likely hearing every word. All it takes is someone like Phineas Nigellus Black to start spreading every single detail of that conversation to other portraits, and voilá! - soon every portrait, including those of previous EW owners and even the possible portraits of the Ignotus brothers, know that Harry has the Wand.
I know paintings can't do you harm, but those people who talk with them, can. Xenophilius Lovegood showed us that althought the Deadly Hallows and the Deathstick aren't actually in the public knowledge, there still is people who believe in these kinds of things. The problem is though, that the owner of the Wand is one and only Harry Potter, the guy who destroyed one of the most powerful wizards of all time. One would need a pretty twisted mind to even attempt to attack the boy who saved everyone, but I doubt the evilness ceases to exist after Voldemort in the wizarding world.
This is just something that has bugged me. I have a feeling that Jo left this thing with the Elder Wand open because she wanted to have something to continue the story from in case she suddenly felt an urge to write more Harry Potter books. Or maybe it's just me wanting the fun never end.
This post has been edited by kaeporagaebora: Jul 12 2008, 04:14 PM
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Jul 12 2008, 05:32 PM
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Rat Tonic Bottler
Posts: 1,147
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Location: Waterloo, ON - getting Butterbeer for Hagrid's "Support Harry Potter" party
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QUOTE(roonwit @ Jul 12 2008, 05:18 PM)  Even those who tried to trace the wand ownership from Grindelwald onwards would have trouble tracking it to Harry because of the way he became master of it.
Not really - Harry made it pretty clear during his convo with LV that he had the EW's power, and there were a lot of eyewitnesses there - I would be very surprised if that story didn't spread out to the wider WW.
QUOTE(roonwit @ Jul 12 2008, 05:18 PM) QUOTE(kaeporagaebora @ Jul 12 2008, 10:12 PM) At the very end of the book Harry had a conversation with Dumbledore's portrait and every Headmaster and Headmistress of Hogwarts was most likely hearing every word. But what did they hear? Harry was very careful not to talk about the wand openly, so even if they wanted to spread the information there would be little they could say.
The most important information of all - where Harry was going to hide it. He didn't say it explicitly, but he did say he would return it to where it was stolen (or something to that effect), and LV made it known during his last convo with Harry that he took it from DD's tomb. It would be difficult to make all these connections, I'll give you that, but if someone were really determined to find the EW after Harry hid it, they would be able to find it if they were to do their homework.
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"Tell me why, why must we fight?
And why must we kill in the name of what we think is right?
No more! No war! 'Cause how do you know?"
-- P.O.D. - from their new album When Angels and Serpents Dance --
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Jul 12 2008, 05:39 PM
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Knockturn Alley Fingernail Vendor
Posts: 766
Joined: 9:46am August 25, 2007
Location: Chicago
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HP2 makes a very well worded point. Harry had the power of the elder wand so he didn't exactly need, it
in that case, to no longer cause chaos and disruption, he disposed of it. As you guys said there were a lot of eye witnesses,
I doubt anyone would be foolish enough to face Harry after he defeated LV. If they did, they'd be quite ignorant.
Especially considering Harry ends up becoming an Auror, that's just asking for death. By the time Harry passes away, It will be long
too late for anyone to figure out where the Elder wand actually is.
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JULIAN/ORCHIDEA
Wisdom is something you earn over time and experience, not something you learn.
So seek it no longer, just let time go and you'll notice your knowledge expand.
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Jul 12 2008, 05:58 PM
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Rat Spleen Restocker at the Apothecary
Posts: 464
Joined: 4:16pm April 26, 2008
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QUOTE(Orchidea15 @ Jul 12 2008, 03:39 PM) HP2 makes a very well worded point. Harry had the power of the elder wand so he didn't exactly need, it
in that case, to no longer cause chaos and disruption, he disposed of it. As you guys said there were a lot of eye witnesses,
I doubt anyone would be foolish enough to face Harry after he defeated LV. If they did, they'd be quite ignorant.
Especially considering Harry ends up becoming an Auror, that's just asking for death. By the time Harry passes away, It will be long
too late for anyone to figure out where the Elder wand actually is.
Wizard duels are kinda like gun fight in old serial westerns.
There's always going to be some young punk who'll think he's hard enough to have a go at Harry.
Then there's also the chance that somebody smart who studies wand lore traces the wand to Harry, Harry could be ambushed, shot in the back and the allegiance of the Elder wand would pass to his slayer. In the story of the 3 brothers the brother with the wand had his throat slit while he slept.
A rather dangerous and desirable wand, probably can't be destroyed and there's always the chance that desperate times may return and Harry may need to take up the Elder Wand again like the retired gun fighter strapping on his six guns.
This post has been edited by cooncatbob: Jul 12 2008, 05:59 PM
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Snape's a brainless Git!!
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Jul 12 2008, 06:31 PM
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Just Through the Brick Wall
Posts: 7
Joined: 5:49pm January 3, 2008
Location: Finland
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QUOTE(roonwit @ Jul 13 2008, 01:18 AM) I don't see why he can't. I think very few people would realise that Harry had the Elder Wand (even after what he said to Voldemort because few there would know significance of what he said). The problem that previous owners had was that they boasted about it (which is why Ollivander thought Gregorovitch might have it). Even those who tried to trace the wand ownership from Grindelwald onwards would have trouble tracking it to Harry because of the way he became master of it.
Very true, but few is still more people than no-one. Most of the people present were Harry's friends and allies, who won't turn against him even if they knew about the wand, but if there were Death Eaters conscious and seeing and hearing what was happening, Harry is screwed. The Death Eaters realise that his wand is something special because Voldemort kept looking for it for months. The wizarding underworld will be after Harry in no time.
QUOTE But what did they hear? Harry was very careful not to talk about the wand openly, so even if they wanted to spread the information there would be little they could say.
Actually, Harry says "I know it's powerful" while holding the wand up and then repairs his broken wand with it. On top of that, he later says "I'm putting the Elder Wand back to where it came from." Saying the Wand's name out loud is strange since he refers the Resurrection stone as "The thing hidden in the Snitch" and the Cloak as "Ignotus's present".
QUOTE(harrypottergeek2 @ Jul 13 2008, 01:32 AM) The most important information of all - where Harry was going to hide it. He didn't say it explicitly, but he did say he would return it to where it was stolen (or something to that effect), and LV made it known during his last convo with Harry that he took it from DD's tomb. It would be difficult to make all these connections, I'll give you that, but if someone were really determined to find the EW after Harry hid it, they would be able to find it if they were to do their homework.
I had to look up at that line where Voldemort mentions stealing the wand from the grave because I didn't remember that, and he actually also says, "...the Elder Wand, the Deathstick, the Wand of Destiny is truly mine!" So, the name of the Wand does get mentioned during the battle, contrary to what I told in the opening post.
But yeah, I agree, it certainly is possible to track down the place Harry hid the Wand. Maybe Harry will hide the Wand behind Dumbledore's portrait where the real Sword of Gryffindor was. However, I suspect that there is a charm in the Wand that prevents the owner from separating from it.
This post has been edited by kaeporagaebora: Jul 12 2008, 06:55 PM
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Jul 12 2008, 06:56 PM
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Product Tester at Weasleys Wizarding Wheezes
Posts: 8,379
Joined: 4:57am January 28, 2005
Location: near Muggleswick, UK
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QUOTE(harrypottergeek2 @ Jul 12 2008, 11:32 PM) Not really - Harry made it pretty clear during his convo with LV that he had the EW's power, and there were a lot of eyewitnesses there - I would be very surprised if that story didn't spread out to the wider WW. That is only true if they knew the significance of the elder wand, and few present would know that. Most would just think that Harry was somehow the true master of the wand Voldemort was using.
QUOTE(harrypottergeek2 @ Jul 12 2008, 11:32 PM) The most important information of all - where Harry was going to hide it. He didn't say it explicitly, but he did say he would return it to where it was stolen (or something to that effect), and LV made it known during his last convo with Harry that he took it from DD's tomb. It would be difficult to make all these connections, I'll give you that, but if someone were really determined to find the EW after Harry hid it, they would be able to find it if they were to do their homework. I think that would be sufficiently difficult to stop anyone tracing it, given that they have to realise that Harry had it in the first place, and getting all this information would be difficult (I doubt it is the sort of thing the portraits would share, particularly with the portrait of Dumbledore to tell them not to). and of course finding the wand isn't enough, as Voldemort eventually discovered.
QUOTE(kaeporagaebora @ Jul 13 2008, 12:31 AM) However, I suspect that there is a charm in the Wand that prevents the owner from separating from it. I rather doubt that since the wand was separated from its true owners for almost the whole of DH.
This post has been edited by roonwit: Jul 12 2008, 06:59 PM
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 W.L.Y.J. We love you Jo |
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Jul 12 2008, 07:28 PM
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Just Through the Brick Wall
Posts: 7
Joined: 5:49pm January 3, 2008
Location: Finland
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QUOTE(roonwit @ Jul 13 2008, 02:56 AM) QUOTE(harrypottergeek2 @ Jul 12 2008, 11:32 PM) Not really - Harry made it pretty clear during his convo with LV that he had the EW's power, and there were a lot of eyewitnesses there - I would be very surprised if that story didn't spread out to the wider WW. That is only true if they knew the significance of the elder wand, and few present would know that. Most would just think that Harry was somehow the true master of the wand Voldemort was using. QUOTE(kaeporagaebora @ Jul 13 2008, 12:31 AM) However, I suspect that there is a charm in the Wand that prevents the owner from separating from it. I rather doubt that since the wand was separated from its true owners for almost the whole of DH.
Voldemort also referred the Elder Wand as the Deathstick and the Wand of Destiny. Surely at least one of these names will ring a bell to most of the people present.
I still think the Wand will stick with Harry. Why wouldn't Dumbledore throw the Wand to the Great Lake when he got it from Grindelwald if it is so easily hideable? No, I think the Wand is sentient, aware of what's happening around it. It knew not to appear to Malfoy, because then it wouldn't have been involved in the big world-changing events. How did Antioch Peverell make a Wand that not only is more powerfull than any other wand but also sentient, is a mystery. This is just my own fanon.
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Jul 12 2008, 11:48 PM
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Rat Tonic Bottler
Posts: 1,147
Joined: 12:36am January 18, 2008
Location: Waterloo, ON - getting Butterbeer for Hagrid's "Support Harry Potter" party
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QUOTE(roonwit @ Jul 12 2008, 07:56 PM) QUOTE(harrypottergeek2 @ Jul 12 2008, 11:32 PM) Not really - Harry made it pretty clear during his convo with LV that he had the EW's power, and there were a lot of eyewitnesses there - I would be very surprised if that story didn't spread out to the wider WW. That is only true if they knew the significance of the elder wand, and few present would know that. Most would just think that Harry was somehow the true master of the wand Voldemort was using.
Not necessarily. As other posters have pointed out, LV mentions the EW/Deathstick/Wand of Destiny explicitly, and there were a lot of other (important) details exchanged in that conversation. If anyone present needed to hear that convo in more detail, all they have to do is grab a Pensieve and off they go; there's enough information in that verbal exchange to gain a lot of valuable information if someone were to really want to get it.
QUOTE(roonwit @ Jul 12 2008, 07:56 PM) I think that would be sufficiently difficult to stop anyone tracing it, given that they have to realise that Harry had it in the first place, and getting all this information would be difficult (I doubt it is the sort of thing the portraits would share, particularly with the portrait of Dumbledore to tell them not to). and of course finding the wand isn't enough, as Voldemort eventually discovered.
Even if you don't look to the portaits for help, if someone were to search in earnest for the EW, a single memory from the legendary Harry-and-LV stand would be enough to set plans in motion (including who had the wand, how the power was transferred, where LV took the wand from). Look at how far DD was able to get in his search for LV's Horcruxes; he had enough sense to search for places of significance, and the verbal exchange between Harry and LV had all the information that a similarily-determined person would need.
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"Tell me why, why must we fight?
And why must we kill in the name of what we think is right?
No more! No war! 'Cause how do you know?"
-- P.O.D. - from their new album When Angels and Serpents Dance --
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