Alchemy In Harry Potter, Thread IV |
Apr 27 2006, 08:49 PM
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Diagon Alley Magical Bricklayer![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 2,876 Joined: 8:17pm June 28, 2005 Location: waiting on summer ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
And so it begins anew...
Old thread can be found here (here's hoping this new link works!) hpaddict This post has been edited by hpaddict: Apr 28 2006, 10:43 AM -------------------- "
It's not just the books under fire now that worry me. It is the books that will never be written. The books that will never be read. And all due to the fear of censorship. As always, young readers will be the real losers." J. Blume |
Apr 28 2006, 02:55 PM
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Eeylops Owl Cage Cleaner![]() ![]() Posts: 218 Joined: 4:20pm May 3, 2005 Location: Indiana ![]() ![]() |
QUOTE My problem with this is that so many scholars say that there are so few that are worthy of this journey. I think that in LV's case he thinks he's an alchemists..They say that the Stone is attainable, but not many can get it. I can see the idea of the alchemists journey in a reverse, But what would he have been in the beginning? He would have went from enlightenment to base matter, which does not make any sense to me... Harry's journey starts from base materials then he goes through the steps, qualifying at each level. Voldemort's journey starts from base materials as well. However, Voldemort decided that he has achieved the stone when he completed the horcruxes. At that point, he thought he was "enlightened" and had all the answers. However, from the cauldron rebirth in book four to the current storyline, he is going backwards. You don't start with a resurrection. It's a cinch that he will end up just base materials and probably no soul, let alone an enlightened soul. |
Apr 28 2006, 06:18 PM
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Fortescue's Spoon Polisher![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 3,539 Joined: 1:29pm March 16, 2005 ![]() |
But Tom Riddle was never worthy of the journey....That is what makes his journey so perverse I guess.
So we have one boy who is the stone, (born from the red king-James and the white queen -Lilly..or the original quareling couple) but this stone is still in its raw form..Anyd we have another boy who "thinks" he is worthy of the journey and was never at all. As a result the "chosen one" is making the right choices and going throught the proper steps and is achieving the end result and another boy who is not the chosen one but thinks he is and as a result is now going in reverse -------------------- |
Apr 28 2006, 08:28 PM
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The Evile Elf Club![]() Posts: 1,371 Joined: 8:17am July 22, 2005 Location: The Office Alliance Podcast recording studio ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
I'm still lurking, completely lost, in this thread--there is so much to think about!!! And Arianhrod, your essays are amazing! I loved reading (and I'm still trying to grasp) your Part II. Brilliant work!!
I searched through the recent posts so I hope I'm crediting the origin correctly here; I'm intrigued by memyslfnI's thoughts regarding Tom's/LV's journey being the alchemical process in reverse (or at least that's how I interpreted it). So I did a Google search for 'reverse alchemy process' and received lots of interesting links. There is this URL, In the Hands of Alchemy: Lightening, that has this to say (bolded for emphasis): QUOTE Finding and acquiring things at the dump is an alchemical process. One must go about it with great care. The particular gods one needs to call up, once the object of choice has been spotted at the dump, are probably in the category of hungry-ghost gods. One must be indifferent to the outcome of any attempted purchase when calling on their help. Too strong a desire renders these gods insatiable; they can easily sabotage the haggling process. Excessive desire creates a reverse alchemy that can work against you. Has this angle been discussed, yet? It does seem as though Tom Riddle, in the process of becoming Lord Voldemort, did experience an excess of desire. I'm currently reading through this PDF, http://www.endabuse.org/programs/healthcare/files/HA_8_1.pdf, about Reverse Alchemy in Childhood; "...going from a normal newborn with almost unlimited potential to a diseased, depressed adult..." Now, doesn't that spark an interest, or what?! -------------------- avatar by fallennotbroken
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Apr 29 2006, 10:50 AM
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Director of Nicholas Flamel Laboratories![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 11,086 Joined: 11:06am January 28, 2005 Location: Lighting the mountain path for Llewellyn ap Gryffudd ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Wow, that's interesting, flipendo! The link to the PDF isn't working, though. I'll try again later
Most of the links to the "reverse alchemy" theme are psychological in nature--and that fits with the idea that not only is LV a very bad guy but he's also mentally ill. How does a child--"gold"--turn into lead? I'm going to look some more on that subject and I'll let you know if I find anything. Just to back up for one second, madamros sent me a PM yesterday about the eclipse of 1999: QUOTE Didn't want to post this info in the alchemy thread, as you've moved way past the topic, but I recently came across a leaflet on the 1999 eclipse (we still have the eclipse viewing glasses!) The eclipse date was Wednesday 11th August (my memory amazes me sometimes!) Total Eclipse was only visible in the far South West of Cornwall and a part of South Devon (and the Channel Isles etc!). 95% eclipse was visible in South Wales, Bristol, London (and my part of the country). Northern England had 85% eclipse. My leaflet doesn't include Scotland, but presumably some percentage of the eclipse was visible from there. Interestingly enough, Ginny's birthday is August 11. I wonder if that's a coincidence. -------------------- The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity.--Harlan Ellison
My father considered a walk among the mountains as the equivalent of churchgoing.--Aldous Huxley |
Apr 30 2006, 01:06 AM
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Assistant to Nicholas Flammel![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 2,201 Joined: 3:46pm July 20, 2005 Location: peering over at M's and Ari's cheat notes! ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Hi all!
Ok flipendo, remember curiousity killed the cat- it was answers that brought him back! (I always have questions Such as... Ginny's name if I remember correctly has to do with foam- white foam of the sea...now aren't the tides effected(affected I always confuse them)by the cycles of the moon? Luna is the closer tie to moon in name...So does Luna somehow influence Ginny? -------------------- spirited member of Vault
"I reject your reality and substitute my own"~Mythbusters |
Apr 30 2006, 07:19 AM
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Cauldron Bottom Measurer![]() ![]() Posts: 134 Joined: 2:33pm January 20, 2006 |
QUOTE(doobie @ Apr 30 2006, 06:06 AM) [snapback]806131[/snapback] Ginny's name if I remember correctly has to do with foam- white foam of the sea...now aren't the tides effected(affected I always confuse them)by the cycles of the moon? Luna is the closer tie to moon in name...So does Luna somehow influence Ginny? Ginny's name is an anagram - Ginevra/Vinegar. Vinegar was also an alchemic ingredient. -------------------- |
May 1 2006, 11:21 AM
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Director of Nicholas Flamel Laboratories![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 11,086 Joined: 11:06am January 28, 2005 Location: Lighting the mountain path for Llewellyn ap Gryffudd ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Ginny's name in Celtic means "white foam." Foam or other dry earth agent is the only thing that can put out a sulfuric acid fire (vitriol=Snape). It's also the Italian form of Guinevere, which means "white," (gwen) and "smooth." From Gwenhyfar, Arthur's wife.
This post has been edited by Arianhrod: May 1 2006, 11:25 AM -------------------- The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity.--Harlan Ellison
My father considered a walk among the mountains as the equivalent of churchgoing.--Aldous Huxley |
May 1 2006, 05:15 PM
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Fortescue's Spoon Polisher![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 3,539 Joined: 1:29pm March 16, 2005 ![]() |
This source has a bit on "alchemical vinigar....
QUOTE Alchemical vinegar is the "water that kills and vivifies". It transmutes the vehicle of consciousness the body, into the vehicle of consciousness the spirit. This involves the separation of body and soul, as vehicles of consciousness. Note that purification is associated with separation. Remember also that the Emerald Tablet associates the process of separation (Earth from Fire/ subtle from gross) "with great judgement and skill", with the three ascending steps from the Below to the Above. --> --> ---> And thereupon followeth the mixture, observe! And so it cometh to a wondrous strength, The finished figures with the unfinished. And if the fire be likewise rightly controlled, It will be entirely perfect In much less time than a year. If Ginerva=Vinegar, which by the way is facinating sussurous! The seperation part is interesting...Is it Ginny that takes Harry to the "next level"? He goes from the conciusness of the body to the concousness of the spirit.. It would be interesting if at this juncture, Harry who finally finds Ginny in book six will finally be perfect within a year (end of book 7) This post has been edited by memyslfnI: May 1 2006, 05:15 PM -------------------- |
May 1 2006, 05:52 PM
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Eeylops Owl Cage Cleaner![]() ![]() Posts: 218 Joined: 4:20pm May 3, 2005 Location: Indiana ![]() ![]() |
I am currently re-reading the Green Lion trilogy by Teresa Edgerton.
The titles of the three books are Child of Saturn The Moon in Hiding The Work of the Sun In the first book, there are chapter titles such as: Encounter with a Dragon Mercury of the Philosophers Of Gold as Well as base Metals A Casket of Bones What is not to love, as the budding alchemists we are, with these titles There is a chapter called, "Game of Cat and Mouse." This got me to wondering, is there any significance, alchemically, to the symbols of cat and mouse/rat? A lion is a type of cat, of course, but rat? In Alice in Wonderland, which is very alchemical, we have the cheshire cat and the doormouse. From Alice in Wonderland: QUOTE Who ARE you talking to?' said the King, going up to Alice, and looking at the Cat's head with great curiosity. `It's a friend of mine--a Cheshire Cat,' said Alice: `allow me to introduce it.' `I don't like the look of it at all,' said the King: `however, it may kiss my hand if it likes.' `I'd rather not,' the Cat remarked. `Don't be impertinent,' said the King, `and don't look at me like that!' He got behind Alice as he spoke. `A cat may look at a king,' said Alice. `I've read that in some book, but I don't remember where.' `Well, it must be removed,' said the King very decidedly, and he called the Queen, who was passing at the moment, `My dear! I wish you would have this cat removed!' Well, it must be removed,' said the King. Scabbers was here first! Also from Alice in Wonderland: QUOTE QUOTE MOUSE'S LONG AND SAD TALE `Fury said to a mouse, That he met in the house, "Let us both go to law: I will prosecute YOU. --Come, I'll take no denial; We must have a trial: For really this morning I've nothing to do." Said the mouse to the cur, "Such a trial, dear Sir, With no jury or judge, would be wasting our breath." "I'll be judge, I'll be jury," Said cunning old Fury: "I'll try the whole cause, and condemn you to death." Edit: The "Long and Sad Tale, came out funny. The original has the story in a crooked tail-like formation Mouse to the cur/dog: Pettigrew to Sirius? This includes trial and punishment. This post has been edited by Weasle Diva: May 1 2006, 05:55 PM |




Apr 27 2006, 08:49 PM










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