Bilbo Baggins, The making of a hero. |
 Jun 12 2008, 08:53 AM
Post
#1
|
|
Exclusive distributor of The Dungbomb Protection Kit  Posts: 2,632 Joined: 10:52pm March 5, 2007    |
 Bilbo Baggins, the ever-so-proper member of the Hobbit community, imagined himself to be the last person in the Shire who would accept an invitation to an adventure. Yet accept it he did, and as he set out with his comrades, he entered onto a path that would turn him into a hero. Leaving his sheltered life presented him with opportunities to test his character and try his values, but these opportunities came at the peril of his own life, and the lives of others. Bilbo's journey is one of personal growth, and the discovery of hidden talents within himself. In considering the following questions, we can come to appreciate the changes Bilbo experiences, and what effect those changes had on Bilbo and those around him. These questions are only a starting point, please feel free to introduce your own thoughts and questions! Why did Gandalph insist that Bilbo was the right What do you believe was the worst trial for Bilbo? What trial do you think changed Bilbo the most? What values do you think Bilbo holds dear, and did those values change from the beginning to the end? Does Bilbo have any negative (for lack of a better word!  ) personality traits? Do those change?
This post has been edited by Pyxis: Jun 12 2008, 11:55 PM |
 |
 
 
|
|
Jun 15 2008, 07:42 AM
Post
#2
|
|
|
Shopping for a New Firebolt Posts: 844 Joined: 9:18pm July 24, 2005 |
Why did Gandalph insist that Bilbo was the right person hobbit, for the job of burgler?
-Gandalf insist in several places that Hobbits are must more than they appear. Certainly Bilbo's size adds to his qualifications, but I believe Gandalf is more interested in qualities that are more noble in nature. It seems that if Gandalf had picked a thief, say a rogue, that was well proven and more than qualified for the job, then some things might have gone more smoothly, but in the end things would have been worse. It took a nobel creature to save the day and unite the factions of men, elf, and dwarf. What talents did Bilbo possess already that he may never have used in the Shire? -Bilbo has a desire for adventure inherited from his ancestors. They are mentioned and Gandalf was certainly aware of this. Most other hobits would have failed simply because this desire wasn't in them. What do you believe was the worst trial for Bilbo? -Honestly leaving the Shire. Once he got past that everything else was a matter of following his nature. Leaving the Shire involved going against his perceived nature. What trial do you think changed Bilbo the most? -Again, leaving the Shire, see above for why. Although, acquiring the ring certainly changed him more in the long run bt one must read LotR to know that. What values do you think Bilbo holds dear, and did those values change from the beginning to the end? -The deepest values, a sense of right and wrong, loyalty, and respect, do not change, in fact those are what really push him into greatness. The surface values all change. On the surface he is interested in all things Hobbit, multiple meals, a quiet life, a good round of gossip ... These all change because Bilbo doesn't really hold them dear. Does Bilbo have any negative (for lack of a better word! biggrin.gif) personality traits? Do those change? -The lesser "values" are really negative traits and they fall by the wayside. Bilbo is also unsure of himself, but I don't know that this is a negative trait. In fact, this lack of confidence does a great deal to help keep him free from the power of the Ring and allows him to make the right choices in the end, though he must overcome this trait to bring about the resolution in the end of the book. 
This post has been edited by Dreamteam: Jun 15 2008, 04:11 PM
Reason for edit: to add in a gold ring for the treasure hunt
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 20 2008, 11:45 AM
Post
#3
|
|
Leaky's Official Donut Maker and Mosquito Man  Posts: 11,140 Joined: 10:51am August 25, 2005 Location: Playing kal-toh with Professor Snape |
This is a really interesting question (or set of questions lol) to look at The Hero's Journey from a Hobbit's point of view. I guess technically it's not a total hero's journey because Bilbo doesnt go on alone at the end to face his foe. That's if we're assuming (which I was) that Smaug is his foe, killed by Bard's arrow. If Bilbo's foe is his own *other side* (as we see so clearly in Smeagol/Gollum that such a thing exists) then I guess he does go off alone, the night when he sneaks out with the Arkenstone, conquering his fears, overcoming any greedy desires brought about by the influence of the Ring, and achieving peace between himself and the dwarfs in the cave, and the elfs, lake-men & Gandalf outside of the cave.
QUOTE Why did Gandalph insist that Bilbo was the right In a sense I'm not sure, because there were more adventurous Hobbits (like the Tooks) but maybe they wouldnt have been so levelheaded as Bilbo. He was a good-natured Hobbit and didnt allow himself to be corrupted by the power of the Ring or the influence of all the treasure. Gandalf must have reckoned that a person of Hobbit stature was need for the job, but Bilbo was the only one with the right balance of caution, sense and courage.QUOTE What talents did Bilbo possess already that he may never have used in the Shire? The sense of adventure that he hadnt ever explored because he lived in his safe little (or not so little) hobbit hole. And the ability to Riddle & keep a cool head under pressure. It's very difficult to think of riddles to pose, or to find the answers to riddles, when someone plans on eating you.QUOTE What do you believe was the worst trial for Bilbo? I agree with P4C, leaving his Hobbit hole & the Shire was the most difficult thing. Oftentimes the worst thing about any trial is the thought of having to go out there and face something. Finding the courage to step outside at all, to take the first step of the adventure was possibly the biggest trial for Bilbo.QUOTE What trial do you think changed Bilbo the most? Probably, apart from actually setting off on the adventure, the first time he kills, on his own. We're even told he feels different, more bold somehow. I dont know if this is a good thing. It served him well on his adventure though.QUOTE What values do you think Bilbo holds dear, and did those values change from the beginning to the end? In my opinion the traditional values are those he holds most dear, the Hobbit way of life like his love of food, not food for food's sake but for the pleasures of fine food and good company. Although he has been changed by going on an Adventure, I think he still mostly values tradition. He gives away much of his treasure, so he hasnt put more value on material riches.QUOTE Does Bilbo have any negative (for lack of a better word! ) personality traits? Do those change? I dont think so. He has doubts about going on the adventure but that's survival common sense. He knows fear and hunger but that's natural. Maybe the only negative trait is a hint of arrogance which we see when he expects thanks from the dwarfs, & gets moody if he doesnt get the praise that he thinks is due him. It gets him into danger with Smaug when he cant resist having the last word, and as a result gets himself burned and endangers many others by getting Smaug mad. I dont know that this changes. Later we know that the Ring has an influence on him, bringing out or playing on the more negative traits. Even at his eleventy first (or whatever it is lol) birthday, he cant resist being the star of the show, letting his arrogance get the better of him. But, by then he is being very influenced by the Ring so I think he's not entirely to blame. I guess it's natural to want our egos flattered, especially when you've just escaped a group of trolls or spiders or elfs, putting oneself in danger. So, it might not be real arrogance after all ...  --------------------   I'm 1 of the 99.99% W.L.Y.J.  When I sleep I dream, and when I dream I can rise above the walls Remember Cameron Duncan Thanks Jeff! |
|
|
|
|
Jun 20 2008, 11:56 PM
Post
#4
|
|
Knight MacMod The Great Protecting The Memory Of Sense Posts: 2,430 Joined: 7:17pm February 17, 2006 Location: 3rd door on the left, Hogsmeade  |
QUOTE Does Bilbo have any negative (for lack of a better word! Bilbo lives in a culture that in many ways is "Dursleyish" (for lack of a better word), not so much in the violent hit-them-with-your-smeltings-stick sense, but more in the perfectly-normal-thank-you-very-much sense. ) personality traits? Do those change?It is very easy to see this as a negative value--a kind of shallow philistine view [American Heritage Dictionary: "A smug, ignorant, especially middle-class person who is regarded as being indifferent or antagonistic to artistic and cultural values"]. Perhaps Hobbit values do not quite reach the point that paintings of poker playing dogs or paintings of Elvis on black velvet rank right up there with Giotto as great art, but there is a kind of anti-intellectualism involved, along with an abhorrence of any kind of self-conscious and deliberate extremism. Non-conformity merely for the sake of non-conformity is an egregious character flaw. Those who behave in a manner that says "look at me! look at me!" are soundly rejected. You can certainly see that in Vernon Dursely's reactions to all those people wearing funny clothes at the opening of Book One. It's great fun to mock all this as arrogant and superficial, and no doubt it deserves mocking to a large degree. However, I would argue that this is the very quality that Gandalf sees in Bilbo, except that Bilbo has qualities that offset the more extreme elements. Remember that it is very much the Hobbit values of common sense and calm decency that make Samwise Gangee the hero that he is. I believe Tolkien is extolling these anti-extremist, down-to-earth, pint-with-the-fellows, regular decent chap (that is, Hobbit) values very highly. I think that what Gandalf saw in Bilbo wasn't his heroism, his ability or willingness to go on a dangerous adventure, but his reticence and good sense not to rush blindly. Like a good burglar, he doesn't immediately think about drawing attention to himself or about appearing brave or aggressive. It's better if a burglar isn't noticed at all. Whether or not Dumbledore thought a good dose of down-to-earth, anti-heroic, pint-with the-fellows values would be good for a developing Harry is something that could be argued, but I firmly believe the value system is an integral part of British culture and can be seen in the way the British stood firm against the Third Reich when France had fallen, Russia was on its knees, and we Americans had not yet entered the war. --------------------  click the Q "And, if there is need to speak in brief summary of this power, we shall find that none of the things which are done with intelligence take place without the help of speech, but that in all our actions as well as in all our thoughts speech is our guide, . . ." Isocrates, Antidosis |
|
|
|
