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Death as a Plot Device in Harry Potter
lirene
post Mar 26 2008, 05:46 PM
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Death is very much a pervasive theme throughout the HP series. From early on, we learn about Harry, the boy who lived; the boy who was orphaned and went to live with his aunt and uncle. I wanted to dedicate this thread to the theme of death; it's different aspects; how it affects and how it is perceived by the different characters in the books; and how this premise seems to enthrall readers of all ages.

How has this very real theme affected you as a reader? Has it broadened your scope; do you find yourself imagining how it will affect you?

Is the theme of death as a plot device warranted in a children's book? Will children understand it? Are there similarities between how death is portrayed in the HP series and between other books which have been published; comparisons with authors.

Did Rowling purposefully choose this topic as a center point since this was something she was dealing with in her own life at the time she began writing the HP series?

How has this theme enriched your understanding and enjoyment of the HP books; has it changed your life in any way? Do you find that you compare yourself to the characters and what they go through?

Parents; how has the theme of death affected you; has this opened communication with your own children; I am sure their curiosity will have brought up many questions.

Death affects each and every character in the book; either directly or indirectly; just as it affects those of us in the very real Muggle world.

These are just some proposed questions and food for thought if you will. Please feel free to contribute anything that I might have inadvertently omitted in my opening post. You are more than welcome to bring in your own opinions, queries, and of course complaints as well.


This post has been edited by lirene: Mar 26 2008, 05:51 PM


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The-T-Dane
post Apr 20 2008, 11:59 AM
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Another angle (besides my earlier input around suffering) I became occupied with by reading HP is this:

So often in every-day-language are people (and I) saying: I could kill ... - But could we?

As seen described, Malfoy is hesitating in the Astronomy tower (HBP), because there is a big difference between thinking/talking about taking another life and then doing it.

JKR made me reflect, because I have actually thought about having to take a life and how I would react.
Mostly it's when I have been in the situation of considering hard facts, while having to cope with my past and how it is affecting my present life. Sometimes the hate towards another human can evoke the feeling of need to act, but could I? - should I? Is hate enough?

How come that for some people (cultures), the idea of superiority is actually enough to make them convinced they have a right to commit murder? The thought of killing muggles for fun is not far fetched, as history as shown us. How were they able to be THAT superior?

At least it was thought-provoking for me.


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Star of Isis
post Apr 27 2008, 07:56 PM
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QUOTE(The-T-Dane @ Apr 20 2008, 05:59 PM) *
So often in every-day-language are people (and I) saying: I could kill ... - But could we?


I had the impression that Harry would have killed Bellatrix if Dumbledore hadn't stopped him... And he might have killed Kreacher if DD hadn't spoken to him to calm his anger... I had the impression that Albus saved him from these mistakes. He was ready to kill Snape at the end of HBP but luckily he wasn't skilled enough to succeed. It seems that it is easy to make this mistake – to let your anger, even righteous, take control over you... I guess that it was a good thing that Harry had someone older and more experienced to protect him from himself at these moments.


QUOTE(The-T-Dane @ Apr 20 2008, 05:59 PM) *
How come that for some people (cultures), the idea of superiority is actually enough to make them convinced they have a right to commit murder? The thought of killing muggles for fun is not far fetched, as history as shown us. How were they able to be THAT superior?


I suppose that if everyone around you agree with the idea of superiority, after you hushed all the criticism, you start to believe that you are entitled to do anything. Because you have 'the right' to do that. Especially when the others are a threat to your ideals and they 'need' to go away, disappear... With all the pure-blood supremacy idea, JKR described yet another common flaw of human nature.




In JKR's books there are many aspects of death – the loss of the love ones, the fear of death, afterlife, taking one's life... It seems that to her death is a part of life, yet another journey, not the end. Just like Dumbledore said it: 'After all, to the well-organized mind, death is but the next great adventure.' I'm not sure if I believe that there's something after death and I'm still far from accepting death with such wisdom... But though I'm not sure that those who passed away are 'just behind the veil', I like reading about it.

To me however, these books are mainly about the despair of those who stay alive and grieve. They show that one person's death affects so many people. When Lily and James died, Harry lost his parents, while Remus and Sirius lost their best friends and family. I felt sorry that Sirius died just because I liked this character. But I also felt sorry that Harry lost his godfather, who was closer to him than his real family. And I felt sorry that Remus lost the last of his closest friends. One life taken, and so many broken hearts. Can it be some consolation to know that you're not the only one who suffers after someone's death? I was disappointed that Harry didn't talk more with Remus after Sirius's death...

Well, there I go again, writing down my thoughts and not getting to any point blush.gif Anyway, I find it harder to accept all the deaths than Harry, and to be honest I would be happier if the last book ended with everybody somehow really brought back to life, I even wrote about it the alternate endings' thread (I know it's pathetic).



P.S. About Tom Riddle - what did you think of Dumbledore asking Harry if he started feeling sorry for Voldemort (after Merope's story)? It seemed awkward because I kind of felt sorry for him too at that moment. So I was wondering if Alus's question was suppose to mean that LV was evil from the day he was born (being descendant of the long line of evil, inbred Gaunts) and Merope's death had no influence on his character. I just keep thinking about this Harry/Dumbledore scene.



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The-T-Dane
post Apr 28 2008, 08:53 AM
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QUOTE(Star of Isis @ Apr 28 2008, 01:56 AM) *
I was disappointed that Harry didn't talk more with Remus after Sirius's death...

Your'e quite good at rambling, so don't worry! About Remus: Wasn't he on a mission for the Order? If I am not confusing my own memory, he was with the werewolfs, trying to find out, how they stood on LV being back and all that?

QUOTE(Star of Isis @ Apr 28 2008, 01:56 AM) *
P.S. About Tom Riddle - what did you think of Dumbledore asking Harry if he started feeling sorry for Voldemort (after Merope's story)? It seemed awkward because I kind of felt sorry for him too at that moment. So I was wondering if Alus's question was suppose to mean that LV was evil from the day he was born (being descendant of the long line of evil, inbred Gaunts) and Merope's death had no influence on his character. I just keep thinking about this Harry/Dumbledore scene.

What I experienced from DD's question was him asking Harry, if there could be any forgiving explenation to LV's choise to be evil. That maybe he was like he was for a reason. - Obviously DD did not have access to Leaky, or he would have considered the proposed Psychopathy-theory in one of the threads (can't remember where). huh.gif

edited for a missing s!


This post has been edited by The-T-Dane: Apr 28 2008, 08:54 AM


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Posts in this topic
- lirene   Death as a Plot Device in Harry Potter   Mar 26 2008, 05:46 PM
- - tryston009   QUOTE(lirene @ Mar 26 2008, 05:46 PM) How...   Mar 28 2008, 01:15 AM
- - HedwigIsntDead   QUOTEHow has this very real theme affected you as ...   Mar 28 2008, 03:57 AM
- - Dora87   QUOTEHow has this very real theme affected you as ...   Mar 28 2008, 09:18 AM
- - lirene   QUOTE(tryston009 @ Mar 28 2008, 02:15 AM)...   Mar 28 2008, 11:33 AM
|- - The-T-Dane   QUOTEIs the theme of death as a plot device warran...   Apr 15 2008, 04:50 PM
- - ljsonline   It is interesting to see your views, and this spri...   Mar 28 2008, 01:26 PM
|- - lirene   QUOTE(ljsonline @ Mar 28 2008, 02:26 PM) ...   Mar 29 2008, 09:44 AM
|- - Star of Isis   It's impossible to discuss death in HP without...   Apr 15 2008, 02:14 PM
- - tryston009   QUOTE(lirene @ Mar 29 2008, 09:44 AM) QUO...   Mar 29 2008, 10:50 AM
- - lirene   Thanks tryston009 for your kind remarks ! Kee...   Apr 4 2008, 02:12 PM
|- - MouldyVoldy   QUOTE(lirene @ Apr 4 2008, 07:12 PM) For ...   Jul 2 2009, 05:46 PM
|- - Mione Weasley   QUOTE(lirene @ Apr 4 2008, 02:12 PM) For ...   Jul 6 2009, 12:16 AM
- - Alkari   I agree with you lirene, that the 'loss' o...   Apr 14 2008, 12:14 AM
- - Alkari   QUOTEI was introduced to death when my mother pass...   Apr 15 2008, 11:02 PM
- - Star of Isis   I wonder how JKR felt when she was introducing a c...   Apr 16 2008, 08:25 PM
|- - The-T-Dane   QUOTE(Star of Isis @ Apr 17 2008, 02:25 A...   Apr 17 2008, 12:46 PM
|- - Star of Isis   QUOTE(The-T-Dane @ Apr 17 2008, 07...   Apr 18 2008, 10:26 AM
|- - The-T-Dane   QUOTE(Star of Isis @ Apr 18 2008, 04:26 P...   Apr 18 2008, 02:46 PM
- - Alkari   I also can't see how people call Neville ...   Apr 18 2008, 04:18 PM
|- - The-T-Dane   QUOTE(Alkari @ Apr 18 2008, 10:18 PM) (Of...   Apr 18 2008, 05:14 PM
- - Maime the Hunter   QUOTEAnyway, there's a saying that what doesn...   Apr 18 2008, 04:18 PM
- - Alkari   I am well aware that many children in RL are abuse...   Apr 19 2008, 03:48 AM
- - Maime the Hunter   QUOTEMine was merely a passing remark: I simply fo...   Apr 19 2008, 02:07 PM
- - Alkari   It doesn't really matter whether it is Hero...   Apr 19 2008, 04:46 PM
- - lirene   QUOTE(Alkari @ Apr 14 2008, 01:14 AM) I a...   Apr 24 2008, 10:35 AM
|- - The-T-Dane   QUOTE(lirene @ Apr 24 2008, 05:35 PM) I r...   Apr 24 2008, 11:48 AM
- - lirene   QUOTE(The-T-Dane @ Apr 24 2008, 12...   Apr 24 2008, 12:16 PM
|- - Emms   I agree with everyone who's saying that this t...   May 31 2009, 12:42 AM
|- - Emms   I agree with everyone who's saying that this t...   May 31 2009, 12:43 AM
- - Lost Centaur   I'd like to point out that both Harry and Nevi...   Apr 25 2008, 02:39 PM
- - lirene   QUOTE(Lost Centaur @ Apr 25 2008, 03:39 P...   Apr 25 2008, 03:15 PM
- - lirene   QUOTE(Star of Isis @ Apr 27 2008, 08:56 P...   May 3 2008, 06:03 PM
- - lirene   I had an interesting conversation last week with o...   Apr 26 2009, 07:37 PM
|- - roonwit   QUOTE(lirene @ Apr 27 2009, 01:37 AM) I h...   Apr 27 2009, 08:09 AM
|- - Mrs_Linnea_Snape   QUOTE(roonwit @ Apr 27 2009, 09:09 AM) QU...   Apr 27 2009, 09:54 PM
|- - hg1   QUOTE(Mrs_Linnea_Snape @ Apr 28 2009, 02...   Apr 29 2009, 03:48 PM
- - Shard   I am not sure what you mean by the question. I don...   Apr 26 2009, 09:58 PM
- - enchantedphoenix   QUOTE(lirene @ Apr 26 2009, 07:37 PM) I h...   May 3 2009, 09:24 PM
- - wickedboy   I thought death was used in some of the above ways...   May 31 2009, 09:46 AM
- - ChristianWizardWorld   "Children's book"? Hardly! The c...   Jun 5 2009, 05:23 PM
- - chloe squibbulus   I think it was a beautiful, but not necessarily un...   Jun 6 2009, 02:03 PM


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