Was Grindenwald Really A Nazi? |
 Jul 28 2007, 01:13 PM
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Just Through the Brick Wall Posts: 3 Joined: 12:14pm July 28, 2007  |
J.K. Rowling has hinted in an interview that the duel between Grindenwald and Dumbledore in 1945 was connected to the end of World War II.
But what could be the nature of the connection between Grindenwald and Adolf Hitler? Many Slavic wizards who studied in Durmstrang also appear to be committed to Grindenwald's ideals despite the fact that Hitler disliked Slavs. (Antonin Dolohov, for example) Grindenwald also killed Viktor Krum's grandparents although Bulgaria was an Axis nation during the war. So why would Grindenwald support Muggle Adolf Hitler? Would it be possible that there are no pure-blooded Jewish wizards? Grindenwald would have certainly taken the side of a pure-blooded Jewish wizard against Muggles. Also, English pure-blood fanatics and later Death Eaters appear to be devoid of racial prejudice. Even the aristocratic and Aryan Draco Malfoy has a black pure-blood friend, Blaise Zabini, who calls Ginny Weasley "a filthy little blood-traitor" although he finds her pretty. |
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Aug 15 2007, 12:48 PM
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Perusing the Magical Menagerie Posts: 85 Joined: 12:06pm July 24, 2007 |
I think any support Grindenwald may have given Hitler would have been a matter of convenience.
In other words, for several years the Nazis had been the biggest dog on the block. If you're planning on taking over the Muggle world, you'd want to insinuate yourself among the most powerful group of muggles you could find. Or perhaps an even more frightening thought: Grindenwald may have been pulling Adolf's strings as part of his master plan to take over the world. Though in all truth, I doubt Ms. Rowling would ever excuse or mitigate Hitler's behavior with an explanation like that. In any case, I have a feeling that while Grindenwald may have been involved with the Nazis in some form or another, it ultimately wasn't that deep of a connection, and certainly wasn't strictly an ideological one (they both had "master race" ideas, but they weren't exactly compatible views of who that "master race" was). This post has been edited by Jmacq1: Aug 15 2007, 12:51 PM |
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Aug 16 2007, 04:01 PM
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Eeylops Owl Cage Cleaner Posts: 220 Joined: 3:49pm July 17, 2007 |
QUOTE(Gellert_Grindenwald @ Jul 28 2007, 07:13 PM) [snapback]1357691[/snapback] J.K. Rowling has hinted in an interview that the duel between Grindenwald and Dumbledore in 1945 was connected to the end of World War II. But what could be the nature of the connection between Grindenwald and Adolf Hitler? Many Slavic wizards who studied in Durmstrang also appear to be committed to Grindenwald's ideals despite the fact that Hitler disliked Slavs. (Antonin Dolohov, for example) Grindenwald also killed Viktor Krum's grandparents although Bulgaria was an Axis nation during the war. So why would Grindenwald support Muggle Adolf Hitler? Would it be possible that there are no pure-blooded Jewish wizards? Grindenwald would have certainly taken the side of a pure-blooded Jewish wizard against Muggles. Also, English pure-blood fanatics and later Death Eaters appear to be devoid of racial prejudice. Even the aristocratic and Aryan Draco Malfoy has a black pure-blood friend, Blaise Zabini, who calls Ginny Weasley "a filthy little blood-traitor" although he finds her pretty. Honestly? I think you've thought more about it than JK Rowling. Jmacq1 I think has it right. Most facists have been willing to contradict their beliefs to help their cause. Don't forget Hitler and Stalin, who were pretty opposed, signed a treaty together. I belief that Grindlewald and Hitler were, in the potterverse, seperate tyrants with seperate ideals who worked, to an extent, together. Racial prejudice is conspicuious in its absense in the Potter books. I cannot think of a single hint of Dean, Blaise, Padma, Parvati, Kingsley or Anglelina facing any prejedice based on their race. However, correct me if i'm wrong, there are no ethnic death eaters? -------------------- My Fan Fiction Chapter 3 now up
“I have come here” began Voldemort, his thin lips showing signs of the smallest smirk “to recruit. You” he said, pointing his wand at James “shall join me. You” he suddenly turned to Lily “shall flee. Please review or PM to help me improve |
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Aug 16 2007, 06:08 PM
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Flesh-Eating-Slug Catcher Posts: 191 Joined: 8:31pm January 19, 2007 |
There are foreign Death Eaters, and black slytherins.
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Aug 16 2007, 06:41 PM
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Butterbeer Connoisseur Posts: 1,456 Joined: 5:38pm June 22, 2007 |
Racial prejudice is not absent in the Harry Potter books, it merely has taken on a different form.
In these books, racial prejudice is directed against Muggles (and by Muggles against wizards, for that matter). It's a way of looking at racial prejudice in a different light; I'm quite surprised that so many people don't see it. -------------------- There is more to life than dreaming.
There is more to love than making it. There is more to you than meets the eye. . . --Mars Bonfire |
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Aug 16 2007, 09:11 PM
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Terrortours Travel Agent Posts: 6,828 Joined: 12:34pm January 24, 2007 |
If you want to give Grindelwald a role in WWII, think of those Nazis with interest in the occult. Perhaps Grindelwald was promising to help them with real magical powers. As for Hitler and the Slavs - many of those who carried out the extermination of the Jews were Slavs. Ukrainian guards were notorious for their cruelty.
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Aug 18 2007, 07:39 AM
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Eeylops Owl Cage Cleaner Posts: 220 Joined: 3:49pm July 17, 2007 |
QUOTE(Danny266 @ Aug 17 2007, 12:08 AM)  There are foreign Death Eaters, and black slytherins. But death eaters and Slytherins aren't the same. I'm wondering whether Voldemort had at least some racial predjudices, not nationalist. QUOTE(Chocolatl @ Aug 17 2007, 12:41 AM) Racial prejudice is not absent in the Harry Potter books, it merely has taken on a different form. In these books, racial prejudice is directed against Muggles (and by Muggles against wizards, for that matter). It's a way of looking at racial prejudice in a different light; I'm quite surprised that so many people don't see it. Well its looking at prejudice, but as two muggles can have a wizard child, and vice verca, I don't see muggles as a seperate race. -------------------- My Fan Fiction Chapter 3 now up
“I have come here” began Voldemort, his thin lips showing signs of the smallest smirk “to recruit. You” he said, pointing his wand at James “shall join me. You” he suddenly turned to Lily “shall flee. Please review or PM to help me improve |
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Aug 18 2007, 07:54 AM
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Stocking Snitches at Quality Quidditch Supplies Posts: 692 Joined: 5:55am March 12, 2005 Location: in my privat book corner  |
I think the Grindelwald-Hitler connection is a mere symbolic one:
At the same time as Hitler tried to overpower the world and started a genozide against the Jews in real history, Grindelwald tried to gain power in JKR's wizarding world. And he thought Muggles were worthless. -------------------- One morning in mid-December, Hogwarts woke to find itself covered in several feet of snow. The lake froze solid and the Weasley twins were punished for bewitching several snowballs so that they followed Quirrel around, bouncing off the back of his turban. (PS, p.210)
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Aug 18 2007, 08:58 AM
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Kibble Boy/Girl at the Magical Menagerie Posts: 287 Joined: 4:50pm March 28, 2007 |
I always thought that Grindelwald imperiused Adolf Hitler, so he was the real person behind WWII. Maybe his plan was to slowly exterminate all Muggles, and he started with a specific population.
-------------------- ~ "Contemplation seems to be about the only luxury that costs nothing" ~ --Cassandra Mortmain Avatar "Damien Hirst's The Magical Impossibility of Anything Much in the Mind of a Pickled Grindylow" by Red Scharlach |
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Aug 18 2007, 09:46 AM
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Buying a Half-Kneazle Posts: 531 Joined: 4:14pm July 7, 2007 Location: chillin at Three Broomsticks |
I've always wondered what the connection was between Grindelwald and the end of WWII and I actually thought that JK would address the issue in DH. (Maybe it will be in her encyclopedia?)
I agree with Oryx that Grindelwald probably promised them some magic if they (or Hitler) in turn helped him out. -------------------- |
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