Harry Potter and Shakespeare, do small connections say something? |
  Mar 25 2008, 10:10 AM
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Getting Fitted for New Dress Robes  Posts: 42 Joined: 11:04am February 12, 2008 Location: Eating old cake with Figgy  |
hello, this has come to my attention recently, as I am reading Macbeth by Shakespeare in my English class. I've only started reading it, so I do not know the general plot, but I have found a few bits of it that are completely Harry Potter. First, there are three witches, and they all have "familiars" or animal spirits. In another thread on the OotP book club, someone talked about familiars, and how the hogwarts pets (owls,toads, cats) could be sort of like familiars in the sense that they protect their owners. (Crookshanks tried to expel Scabbers because he was actually Pettigrew, for instance) Is this a stray connection, or is it a nod to Shakespeare?
Additionally, the three witches are referred to as "The Weird Sisters," which, as we know, is also the name of the wizarding rock band in the series. just wanted to know what you all thought!  mods--I dont know if this thread is in the right category, please move it if it isn't. merci! -------------------- "But why's she got to go to the library?" "Because that's what Hermione does," said Ron. "When in doubt, go to the library." Can you dance like a hippogriff? |
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Mar 25 2008, 10:23 AM
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Cauldron Bottom Measurer Posts: 107 Joined: 9:47am February 28, 2008 Location: Flat above Zonko's Joke Shop, Hogsmeade. |
That's a very interesting point
 I haven't read any Shakespeare so i can't really specifically say but i imagine if there is somebody as influential as shakespeare anybody who has studied english would relate to him in some way while writing a book
-------------------- Excuse me; are you the imprint of a departed soul?
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Mar 25 2008, 11:39 AM
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Hiding in the Iron Maiden at Borgin and Burkes Posts: 321 Joined: 8:01am August 4, 2007 Location: Prince Edward Island, Canada |
Like most writers, Rowling would be an avid reader. There are some books that I have read where the similarities between these books and the Harry Potter series that are just too close for coincidence.
The Canterbury Tales is one example. In the same paragraph the words Dumbledores and Hagrid appear. The same book has a town called Casterbridge that has a pub called the Three Mariners (three broomsticks in H. P.) and Peter's Finger (Hogs Head/ plus the obvious connection about Peter Pettigrew). Geoffrey Chaucer's The Canturbury Tales is another example. The Pardoner's Tale is about three young men who try to cheat and kill Death. It reminded me of the three Peverell brothers in Deathly Hallows. None of this takes away from her writing. Shakespeare wrote Henry the Fifth, Troilus and Crysiede (hope I spelled that right) based on other authors writings. But it is the way that he wrote the stories that makes his stand out from the rest. Nobody could ever come close to telling it as well as he could. J. K. Rowling never outright took another authors story and wrote it in her own style. She just combined lots of things she had read over her lifetime into one of the greatest literary successes ever written. That just makes me a grateful reader that she was such a great reader.  |
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Mar 25 2008, 12:12 PM
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Diagon Alley Watchwizard Posts: 2,287 Joined: 5:11pm May 4, 2007 Location: Texas |
Actually, Jo acknowledges a huge nod to Shakespeare:
QUOTE ES: What if he never heard the prophecy?
JKR: And that's it, isn't it. As I said, that's what I posted on my site - ES: I'm glad you put that up. JKR: It's the “Macbeth” idea. I absolutely adore “Macbeth.” It is possibly my favorite Shakespeare play. And that's the question isn't it? If Macbeth hadn't met the witches, would he have killed Duncan? Would any of it have happened? Is it fated or did he make it happen? I believe he made it happen. -------------------- "It is our choices, Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities."
-Albus Dumbledore |
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Mar 25 2008, 12:35 PM
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Eeylops Owl Cage Cleaner Posts: 242 Joined: 9:14pm April 4, 2006 |
JKR has also mentioned that she took the name Hermione from Shakespeare's "A Winter's Tale." I think she, like other great writers, incorporates a lot of collective cultural unconscious when writing -- i love when i recognize a detail (i remember this when i read about the Weird Sisters in HP) from another source...
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Apr 24 2008, 11:07 AM
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Being Chosen by a Wand at Ollivander's Posts: 2,991 Joined: 7:59am June 6, 2006 |
QUOTE(otter_patronus @ Mar 25 2008, 03:10 PM)  Is this a stray connection, or is it a nod to Shakespeare? Additionally, the three witches are referred to as "The Weird Sisters," which, as we know, is also the name of the wizarding rock band in the series. I think many writers draw reference from Shakespeare as his work is so influential in the western world, I would like to think of these little details such as "The weird sisters" as being a kind of salutary nod to his work. Incidentally one of Terry Pratchetts discworld novels is named "wyrd sisters", this book is an actual parody of Macbeth but of course I immediately associated it with Harry  QUOTE(twillick @ Mar 25 2008, 04:39 PM) Shakespeare wrote Henry the Fifth, Troilus and Crysiede (hope I spelled that right) based on other authors writings. But it is the way that he wrote the stories that makes his stand out from the rest. Nobody could ever come close to telling it as well as he could. Romeo and Juliet, one Shakespeare's best known plays, was also developed from the work of another writer, it reportedly stems from Arthur Brooke's poem "The Tragical History of Romeus and Juliet", first published in 1562. --------------------  |
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Apr 24 2008, 12:41 PM
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Hiding in the Iron Maiden at Borgin and Burkes Posts: 321 Joined: 8:01am August 4, 2007 Location: Prince Edward Island, Canada |
QUOTE(Azkaban's_Angel @ Apr 24 2008, 02:07 PM) QUOTE(otter_patronus @ Mar 25 2008, 03:10 PM) Is this a stray connection, or is it a nod to Shakespeare? Additionally, the three witches are referred to as "The Weird Sisters," which, as we know, is also the name of the wizarding rock band in the series. I think many writers draw reference from Shakespeare as his work is so influential in the western world, I would like to think of these little details such as "The weird sisters" as being a kind of salutary nod to his work. Incidentally one of Terry Pratchetts discworld novels is named "wyrd sisters", this book is an actual parody of Macbeth but of course I immediately associated it with Harry QUOTE(twillick @ Mar 25 2008, 04:39 PM) Shakespeare wrote Henry the Fifth, Troilus and Crysiede (hope I spelled that right) based on other authors writings. But it is the way that he wrote the stories that makes his stand out from the rest. Nobody could ever come close to telling it as well as he could. Romeo and Juliet, one Shakespeare's best known plays, was also developed from the work of another writer, it reportedly stems from Arthur Brooke's poem "The Tragical History of Romeus and Juliet", first published in 1562. Shakespeare's plays, Henry the Fifth, King Lear, Cymbeline and the plot line from Macbeth were all based or borrowed from a man by the name of Raphael Holinshed who wrote The Chronicles of England, Scotland and Ireland in the 1580's. Shakespeare also wrote parts of Henry the Fifth from Hall's- The Union of The Noble and Illustrious Families of Lancaster and York (1542?). My oldest nephew often complains about learning Shakespeare in high school. He always asks the same question. "What's the point? The plays have nothing to do with now." After all the excellent novels being published lately (especially H. P.) I hope that he can see the point that Shakespeare is very relevant in relation to a lot of the literature that we read today.   |
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Apr 24 2008, 03:47 PM
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Flesh-Eating-Slug Catcher Posts: 192 Joined: 10:36pm February 3, 2008 Location: ....WAIT! Where am I!? |
We had this discussion in my english class! we actually started with which we should be reading. So we were asked which we'd prefure and almost everyone said harry potter.
-------------------- DANCE: verb; to be an athlete, artist, and entertainer all at one time
Justice for Christopher Skinner. |
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Apr 25 2008, 09:48 AM
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Being Chosen by a Wand at Ollivander's Posts: 2,991 Joined: 7:59am June 6, 2006 |
QUOTE(dance24/7 @ Apr 24 2008, 08:47 PM) We had this discussion in my english class! we actually started with which we should be reading. So we were asked which we'd prefure and almost everyone said harry potter. I(surprisingly enough  ) wouldn't like to see HP used for exam purposes or in the education system. I think literary analysis in a school environment often destroys whatever story you're reading. Many teachers tell you what to think, tell you how the story should be interpreted, tell you what's the right opinion to have. I would hate to see HP dissected in this manner. I studied "To Kill a Mockingbird" for my Junior Certificate, I had read it a few years prior and really enjoyed it but all the over-analysis that came with studying it for an exam ruined the story for me, I wouldn't like to see that happen to HP too.
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May 2 2008, 06:28 AM
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Just Through the Brick Wall Posts: 8 Joined: 4:24pm February 20, 2008 |
In my homecountry (Norway), there's this book full of theories of the names in HP, that Rowling has gotten inspiration from the Bible, and so on. Well, if the authors of that book can connect HP to the Holy Grale, I don't see why it can't have a connection to Shakespeare.
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