ReadingGroup Corner Booth Trancript: Feb 3, 2007, Goblet of Fire: Chapters 29 - 31 |
 Feb 3 2007, 01:59 PM
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Organizing the Halo Rebellion  Posts: 3,301 Joined: 2:09pm April 16, 2006 Location: Being angelic, of course   |
Today's text chat moderators were: Aislinn, Expelliarmas, fawkes28, Mr. McGonagall, Poet, SoonerGryffindor
[12:58] *** fawkes28 has joined #lounge [12:58] *** Topic is: Open Reading Group Chat [12:58] *** Topic set by Aislinn [Thu Dec 7 20:19:15 2006] [12:58] <MrMcGonagall> Hi, fawkes! [12:58] <Pellinore> thanks ;o.. hello back MrM ;) [12:58] *** SoonerGryffindor has joined #lounge [13:00] <MrMcGonagall> Hi, Sooner! [13:00] <SoonerGryffindor> Hello everyone [13:00] *** cbm has joined #lounge [13:00] <fawkes28> hey cbm [13:00] *** nympheart has joined #lounge [13:01] <Pellinore> * /wave ;o [13:01] <nympheart> hello all [13:01] <MrMcGonagall> hi, nymph! [13:02] <nympheart> quiet in here [13:02] *** JaneMarple9 has joined #lounge [13:02] <nympheart> hi Jane [13:02] <MrMcGonagall> Hi, Jane! [13:02] <JaneMarple9> Hello everybody ! smile [13:02] <fawkes28> hi jane [13:05] *** Expelliarmas has joined #lounge [13:05] <nympheart> hi Expie [13:05] <fawkes28> hi expie [13:05] *** cbm has quit [Bye] [13:06] <SoonerGryffindor> hey Expie [13:06] <Expelliarmas> heya peeps [13:06] *** bemused has joined #lounge [13:06] <JaneMarple9> Hi Expie [13:06] <nympheart> hi bemused [13:06] <JaneMarple9> hi bemused [13:06] <Poet> hey Expelliarmas [13:06] <SoonerGryffindor> hi bemused [13:06] <bemused> hello everyone! [13:07] <Expelliarmas> everyone recovered from the news of the book release? [13:07] <nympheart> I think so [13:07] <MrMcGonagall> I'm recovered [13:07] <fawkes28> boo - it is too early [13:07] <JaneMarple9> think so w00t2 [13:07] <Pellinore> July is going to be chaotic [13:08] <JaneMarple9> The film and the book!! [13:08] <bemused> pass the smelling salts... fawkes, I agree! [13:08] <MrMcGonagall> That's an understatement, Pellinore! biggrin [13:08] <JaneMarple9> Not all that interested in the film...wait for it on DVD [13:08] <nympheart> I go see the films, after the crowds die down [13:08] <JaneMarple9> But just "might" be persuaded to by the book biggrin [13:08] <Pellinore> JkR should kidnap Steve Vanderark to make sure there's no inconsistencies, 7th book is so much more important to wrap up plot lines then any other. [13:08] <fawkes28> i really didnt want it to come until at least halloween [13:09] <bemused> go on, Jane - not really wink [13:09] <nympheart> lol, she should, Pellinore [13:09] <SoonerGryffindor> I am still in a state of depression [13:09] <JaneMarple9> Hallowe'en sounded good but I much perfer July [13:09] <Poet> Yeah, I'm sad simply because I can't go to Scotland [13:09] <Pellinore> aw Sooner, we'll still luv ya after its released ;) [13:10] <MrMcGonagall> I'm more fretful over the fact that Jo went to a hotel to finish writing the series. I just find it odd. [13:10] <nympheart> that is interesting MrM [13:10] <Expelliarmas> i don't she likely needed the solittude [13:10] <SoonerGryffindor> I think she needed to be away from it all Mr M [13:10] <bemused> For peace and quiet, maybe.... [13:10] <fawkes28> she needed to be away from everyone - i dont blame her [13:10] <Pellinore> gave her some peace and quite at the biggest moment in the book series. [13:10] <JaneMarple9> well maybe she wanted to lock herself away [13:10] <Pellinore> quiet... O: [13:10] <SoonerGryffindor> as hard as this has been for us.... imagine how hard that must have been on her [13:10] <bemused> why does it worry you, Mr M? [13:10] <JaneMarple9> after all she has three kiddies - one two year old [13:10] *** pamelitaluisa has joined #lounge [13:11] <nympheart> hi pamelitaluisa [13:11] <Pellinore> She probably just wanted to make sure she was focused w/out distractions. [13:11] <MrMcGonagall> Why Jo would want to be that "alone" to finish the series. [13:11] <fawkes28> it makes me worried now sad [13:12] <bemused> perhaps because she has lived with it so long, and so many people are waiting on the outcome - she had to get it right [13:12] <JaneMarple9> Well she had to finnish it somewhere biggrin [13:12] <Pellinore> she's always written the book series alone, not like talked to her kids or Neil about the book plots ;o [13:12] <Poet> When she finished the last chapter - she wrote about what happened to them the rest of their lives - basically in her world they've all grown old and died [13:12] <fawkes28> i just hope i dont get spoiled [13:12] <JaneMarple9> The Rowling kiddies must be glad the series is finished [13:13] <JaneMarple9> They'd literally grown up with Harry [13:13] <fawkes28> well, she is editing now [13:13] <Pellinore> oh the Hype and chaos is just begginning [13:13] <fawkes28> so they dont have her back yet [13:13] <JaneMarple9> be even crazier soon [13:13] <JaneMarple9> But then again...crazy is good! [13:13] <bemused> Must be even harder for her to edit 'cos she has two editions going at once [13:14] <pamelitaluisa> hi nympheart - my first time here, is this now the Chamber of Secrets chat, or just general chat? [13:14] <Pellinore> will not be until 6+ months after the last book before it really dies down unless there's unresolved plot holes.. then maybe we can see JkR tell the Movie Directors stuff that happened that's not in the books to suppise us at the theaters. [13:14] <fawkes28> a reading group chat [13:14] <JaneMarple9> We're talking about the Gobler of Fire [13:14] <JaneMarple9> Chapters 28 to 31 I believe [13:14] <Expelliarmas> This is the Goblet of Fire chat for the Reading Groups; you'll have no problem if you've read the book [13:14] <Pellinore> GoF chapters 29-31 [13:14] <pamelitaluisa> fabulous! just finished re-reading GoF [13:14] <Expelliarmas> actually, its 29-31 [13:14] <fawkes28> woo hoo smile [13:15] <Poet> Yep 29-31 smile [13:15] <JaneMarple9> biggrin nearky right! [13:15] <JaneMarple9> nearly* too [13:16] <fawkes28> We will be starting the discussion in a few minutes. You’re not going to be able to type for a few minutes while we make some announcements, please bear with us, you’ll be able to type again soon. [13:16] *** SevenofNine has joined #lounge [13:16] <fawkes28> There may be times during the chat when a moderator will want to PM something to you. Please keep an eye on the top of your screen, right next to the button with #Lounge on it. A button will appear with one of the mods' names on it. If you see that appear, click on it to see the PM that has been sent to you by that mod [13:16] <fawkes28> You won’t be able to reply to that PM, but if you could just say something like "Sooner, got it” in the main chat, to let us know that you have seen it, that will be great. We'd also like to remind you that the rules of the Lounge also apply here in the Corner Booth, and may be found here: http://www.leakylounge.com/?act=rules [13:16] <fawkes28> If you need to contact us during the chat, send one, or all, of us a PM on the Lounge. We will be checking them regularly, but if we haven't replied after a little while then please let us know here that you have sent a PM. Thanks for your cooperation! [13:16] <fawkes28> While its easy to drift off in various directions, let's all try to have a fun chat by sticking to the topic for today. OK, moving on to the topic for the chat! [13:17] <Poet> The Trio talk about Mr. Crouch and Krum up in the Owlery. They run into Fred and George who are sending a (blackmail) letter. The Trio ask fake Moody his opinion about how Mr. Crouch disappeared so fast. Moody tells Ron and Hermione to help Harry prepare for the Third Task. [13:17] *** Kneazly has joined #lounge [13:17] <Poet> Harry gets a reply from Sirius scolding him for hanging out with Krum. Later during Divination, Harry falls asleep and dreams he’s riding an eagle owl. In his dream he sees a snake, Wormtail, and LV. Harry awakens in pain and goes to Dumbledore where he discovers the Pensieve. Harry sees three courtroom memory scenes - Karkaroff's, Bagman's, and the the one with Barty, Jr. [13:17] <Poet> At Barty's trial, Harry learns that the Lestranges tortured the Longbottoms into insanity. Dumbledore appears next to Harry and takes him back to the office and shows him more memories: Snape and the Dark Mark getting clearer; Bertha being nosy. Dumbledore thinks Harry's dream was likely real. Dumbledore won’t say why he trusts Snape. [13:17] <Poet> Harry tells Ron and Hermione about what he saw (but not about the Longbottoms). Hermione stews about Rita and how she gets her information. During a practice session, Ron spots Malfoy talking to something in his hand. The morning of the Third Task, the Daily Prophet has another foul story by Rita Skeeter, which hints of Harry being a parseltongue-speaking loon who might be claiming pain just to get attention. [13:17] <Poet> At the Third Task, Hagrid, fake Moody, McGonagall, and Flitwick patrol the exterior of the maze. Krum Crucios Cedric and Harry stuns Krum. Harry finds the Triwizard Cup! Cedric and Harry fight off a spider. Cedric turns toward the Cup, but sees the injured Harry. They bicker over who should take the Cup and decide to take it together. [13:17] <Poet> All caught up? Good! Turning to the chat: [13:17] *** Pleshette has joined #lounge [13:17] <Poet> Why do you think Crouch was sanest when speaking of Voldemort? [13:18] <MrMcGonagall> That was the part of himself that wasn't under the imperius. "Himself" speaking, basically. [13:18] <bemused> 'cos that's when he was fighting the imperious, and aware of what was happening to him [13:18] <JaneMarple9> Hi Pleshette and hi 7of9 [13:18] <bemused> *imperius - hello Pleshette! [13:18] <Pleshette> Hello everyone! [13:18] <JaneMarple9> he was fighting the imperivious curse yes [13:18] <SevenofNine> I think it was because he was so focused. [13:19] <JaneMarple9> and he very nearly managed to defeat it [13:19] <nympheart> Thinking of LV probably helped him fight it [13:19] <SevenofNine> LV had been Crough Sr's enemy all those years and to be under his control must have been tearing him apart. [13:19] <JaneMarple9> he was focussed on giving a warning to Harry and Dumble [13:19] <Poet> I was surprised though how he was sometimes talking as of it was 13 or so years ago [13:19] <Pleshette> Good point nymph. It must have been very difficult for him to fight it [13:19] <JaneMarple9> His mind was wandering I think Poet [13:19] <SevenofNine> Well, LV was around back then and then back now [13:19] <SevenofNine> It all tied back to LV [13:20] <Poet> I agree SevenofNine - he had something that he really wanted to say - and those thoughts and words broke through the jumble at times [13:20] <Kneazly> Perhaps it was on his mind because he knew his son was masquerading as Moody, so he was thinking about his son. [13:20] <nympheart> He still wasn't thinking copletely straight [13:20] <JaneMarple9> perhaps yes [13:21] <SevenofNine> Well, he was definitely having a hard time figuring out the day. ;) [13:21] <Expelliarmas> i think that's when he was most desperate to get off his chest [13:21] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that was because of the seriousness of the situation [13:21] <Expelliarmas> it was his actions which gave us the chain of events which got LV back--his fault [13:21] <SevenofNine> Well, can you imagine his horror when LV showed up at his house? [13:21] <MrMcGonagall> Yes, the imperius was sort of fading in and out. [13:21] <Pellinore> I'm not sure BCsr. new that Jr. was Moody. I know he knew Jr. was at Hogwarts but the exact person he was duping might not be known. [13:21] <nympheart> yes, and he spent time talking about Jr. too as a result of guilt [13:22] <SevenofNine> Suddenly finding himself a pawn of this evil he'd fought against--and lost his son to [13:22] <Pleshette> And his one focus all his life was to stop LV and the DEs. I think that's what gave him the strength to break through the curse [13:22] <Poet> What do you think of the twins technique for dealing with Bagman? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:22] <SevenofNine> Yes, Pleshette [13:22] <JaneMarple9> clever [13:22] <JaneMarple9> very Fred and George-ish [13:23] <MrMcGonagall> Well, they're to the point where they feel they need to play hardball. [13:23] <SevenofNine> Gotta love those guys. [13:23] <nympheart> that's one of the scenes that help show that the twins are not completely identical personality-wise [13:23] <fawkes28> they are so good at dealing with people in the real world [13:23] <bemused> mildly unscrupulous - but no more than he deserved [13:23] <Pellinore> don't think they had many other options. no adult would really help them i think. They would just tell the kids to chalk it up to experience and move on. [13:23] <Kneazly> They might argue between themselves, but back each other up when questioned. [13:23] <JaneMarple9> Yes one Twin seemed to err on side of caution in blackmailing Bagman [13:23] <Poet> I was surprised that they were actually using the words "blackmail" - afterall the money is technically theirs [13:24] <Pleshette> They make a good team [13:24] <JaneMarple9> or am I wrong [13:24] <nympheart> Fred was ready to go ahead and blackmail, George was more cautious [13:24] <Poet> You're totally right JaneMarple9 [13:24] <fawkes28> i think this experience predicts that they will be good businessmen [13:24] <JaneMarple9> They are a good team - just as good a team as the trio [13:24] <Kneazly> The money may be technically theirs, but blackmail would still be wrong [13:24] <SoonerGryffindor> interesting that one of them was acting more cautious than the other [13:24] <SevenofNine> Yes, one of them willing to take the risk while the others looks at the dangers [13:24] <SevenofNine> *other [13:24] <Expelliarmas> their personalities complement each other [13:25] <Poet> I mean - I don't think the word "blackmail" was necessary - they were just threatening to go to the authorities to get their money back that they were owed [13:25] <JaneMarple9> yes this proved to them that weasleys wizarding wheezes would be a success [13:25] <Pleshette> Exactly expie [13:25] <Kneazly> I wonder how many other people Bagman cheated, besides the goblins--how many people are gunning for him besides Fred and George? [13:25] <MrMcGonagall> Interesting example of seeing them responding to one another rather than "the twins" responding to others as if they were a single unit. [13:25] <Pellinore> sometimes in the real world you have to put presure on people to get them to give you what's rightfully yours. Its not blackmail its negotiations. [13:25] <SoonerGryffindor> that is a good question Kneazly [13:25] <Poet> I don't think they were asking for more money that what was owed them - right. [13:25] <JaneMarple9> probably lots Kneazly [13:25] <SevenofNine> Well, they blackmailed the same way hermione did with Rita [13:25] *** Whisperwing has joined #lounge [13:25] <nympheart> hi whisper [13:25] <SevenofNine> Just trying to get the other person to make the right choice [13:25] <JaneMarple9> hi whisper [13:25] <bemused> I wonder if JKR knows any twins - she creates a good twin dynamic [13:25] <Whisperwing> Heya [13:26] <SevenofNine> Greetings Whisperwing [13:26] <Pleshette> Hi whisperwing [13:26] <Expelliarmas> well, they were engaged in gambling which likely isnt legal; so blackmail would be the right word [13:26] <Whisperwing> Talking twins eh? [13:26] <Pellinore> I'd say Hermione blackmailes while the twins just pressured bagman to do turn over money that was their's to begin with. [13:26] <Poet> And I don't think they were asking for money to stay quiet about Bagman's gambling - just the money that was due them, so I don't see it as blackmail [13:26] <Whisperwing> Since he paid them in leprechaun gold [13:26] <SevenofNine> Right, Poet [13:26] <Pleshette> Yes [13:27] <SevenofNine> They weren't asking for what wasn't already theirs [13:27] <Pellinore> depends on if the gambling was legal or not i guess. [13:27] <SevenofNine> Bagman was still responsible for taking their money then [13:27] <nympheart> I think it probably was legal, as Arthur participated as well [13:27] <Whisperwing> Doesn't seem as if it's illegal, the bets were being taken openly at the QWC [13:27] <SevenofNine> That's stealing [13:27] <Poet> It seems gambling was legal, but that Bagman shouldn't have been doing it since he was a part of the department that was running the event [13:27] <JaneMarple9> it was sneaky paying them in leprechaun gold [13:27] <bemused> I think it must hav been legal 'cos they were doing it quite openly [13:27] <SevenofNine> They should have sent his sorry butt to Azkaban. Contributing to the delinquency of a minor [13:27] <Poet> Fred and George accuse Ron of acting like prefect-Percy. Was Ron butting in or just worried ... or both? (Chamber 37) [13:27] <Kneazly> It must depend on what they were actually putting in the letter--perhaps they were threating to tell someone they had been paid in Leprechaun gold. AFter all, they'd been asking for it back before this. [13:27] <Whisperwing> That's a bit like Pete Rose betting on baseball [13:27] <nympheart> It wasn't fair to take advantage of them for their age [13:28] <JaneMarple9> but Bagman choose the wrong people to fool! [13:28] <Pleshette> I'm glad they had the nerve to stand up to him and demand what was rightfully theirs [13:28] <fawkes28> i think ron was just trying to be a voice of reason [13:28] <Pellinore> Butting in.. what else are little brothers for ;) [13:28] <MrMcGonagall> I think Ron has some reason to be concerned. [13:28] <Poet> I think it was a nice hint about Ron becoming prefect in Book 5 [13:28] <SoonerGryffindor> I think they just said that to get Ron off their backs [13:28] <fawkes28> i would never compare ron to percy [13:28] <SevenofNine> I think it was a bit of both [13:28] <Whisperwing> Hm, curious, not trying to be bossy [13:28] <nympheart> I agree sooner [13:28] <JaneMarple9> they do tire of Ron sometimes [13:28] <bemused> Both, I think, Poet - thought it was funny they teased him about being prefect - then he becomes one [13:28] <Whisperwing> That's true [13:28] <fawkes28> very true, bemused [13:28] <Pellinore> You might not Fawkes but it was a good tactic by the twins to get Ron to back down and question his motives. [13:28] <nympheart> doesn't everyone tire of their younger siblings occasionally? [13:28] <JaneMarple9> they love him but find him a pest [13:28] <SevenofNine> Ron's not the risk taker the twins are. Ron's funny because he'd like to be what Percy is but now how Percy is, if that makes sense [13:29] <Kneazly> Ron was just trying to protect them--doesn't want them doing somthing so wrong they get in real trouble [13:29] <JaneMarple9> probably! [13:29] <Pellinore> clever of the twins but percy <> ron. [13:29] <MrMcGonagall> I think that makes perfect sense, 7of9 [13:29] <Pleshette> I agree kneazly and sometimes I find that the twins can be kind of mean to him [13:29] <Pleshette> two against one kind of thing [13:30] <fawkes28> they definitely are pleshette [13:30] <Whisperwing> Kind of? Turning the teddy bear into a spider's more than kind of mean [13:30] <SevenofNine> Well, There's already been an older brother role model for Ron in the form of Bill. [13:30] <JaneMarple9> the Twins have worked as a team [13:30] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that the twins know that being compared to Percy will really get under Ron's skin so that is why they said that to him [13:30] <bemused> Mm - they tend to do that [13:30] <Pellinore> and the Unbreakable vow was beyond mean [13:30] <SevenofNine> I think that was ignorant risk taking. [13:30] <Pellinore> agree with Sooner. [13:30] <JaneMarple9> yes the teddy bear into a spider was pure evil! sad [13:30] <Poet> What do you make of Harry's dream? Is there something more to it than simply seeing what Voldie is doing at that minute? If Harry is connected to Voldemort, why is he able to feel the Crucio directed at Wormtail? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:30] <Whisperwing> Yeah but that doesn't come into context for two more 'years' [13:30] <JaneMarple9> Funny but evil! [13:31] <JaneMarple9> don't know what to make of the dream [13:31] <SevenofNine> I think there's a lot in Harry's dreams. [13:31] <Pleshette> The connection is getting stronger as LV gets stronger [13:31] <JaneMarple9> perhaps foreshadowing [13:31] <bemused> Doesn't he feel Voldemort's pleasure/hatred/whatever? [13:31] <Pellinore> Maybe the spell gives feedback to the caster.. really twisted if you can feel the anguish of the target. [13:31] <nympheart> I think it gets stronger as both LV and Harry get stronger [13:31] <Kneazly> It's an odd "dream"--Harry doesn't see it from LV's point of view, but outside--just like the first dream [13:32] <SevenofNine> Ewww. What a thought Pellinore--and so LV [13:32] <Whisperwing> He seems to be picking up the punishments Voldemort metes out as well, maybe VOldemort has a masochistic side where he slips into the mind of his victims to share in their agony [13:32] <fawkes28> yes, nymph - their connection is definitely growing [13:32] <Poet> I don't think he feels the Crucio, but that he senses the anger that was required of Voldemort to create the Crucio [13:32] <Pleshette> Strange that he rides on the back of the eagle owl also [13:32] <bemused> But surely it is really happening - like the murder of Frank Bryce, which he also sees as a dream [13:32] <Kneazly> Yes poet [13:32] <pamelitaluisa> I think the "pain' Harry feels is the pain in his scar at V's intense emotion, not Wormtail's pain on receiving the Crucio [13:32] <SevenofNine> Who has an Eagle Owl? [13:32] <nympheart> yes, Pleshette, it is an odd vantage point [13:32] <JaneMarple9> draco [13:32] <SevenofNine> Is Hermes one? [13:32] <Pleshette> I agree bemused [13:32] <Pellinore> Lucious/Draco [13:32] <bemused> The eagle owl is interesting [13:33] <nympheart> I don't think it's the Malfoys' owl though [13:33] <JaneMarple9> Draco has a eagle owl [13:33] <Whisperwing> The biggest of the owls [13:33] <Poet> What’s the significance of Harry flying upon an eagle owl, which to this point has mostly been associated with the Malfoys? (Basement Room 10) [13:33] <SevenofNine> Wow, so Draco has an eagle owl. [13:33] <Pellinore> Lucious & Draco's Eagle owl is the only one we know of. [13:33] <nympheart> LV hadn't contacted Lucius yet [13:33] <Kneazly> Could the eagle owl be Crouch Srs? [13:33] <Whisperwing> Possibly [13:33] <nympheart> I think it was a possibly a school owl [13:33] <bemused> Does anyone think we're meant to connect it with Draco's owl? [13:33] <JaneMarple9> Never noticed the significance myself [13:33] <Pellinore> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_owl [13:33] <MrMcGonagall> I don't think it could be the Malfoys' owl. Doesn't make sense in the plot. Moody obviously sent the owl. [13:33] <nympheart> I don't bemused [13:33] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that Harry was really seeing what was occuring (like with the Frank Bryce dream) and that the owl delivering the message was the Malfoy's owl [13:33] <Expelliarmas> so far as we know, the Malfoys are the only ones which use the eagle owl [13:34] <Kneazly> Maybe an eagle owl simply symbolizes a powerful family [13:34] <Poet> Well the Eagle is a leader, but also a loner. It is also an elitest sort of symbol. [13:34] <bemused> I think it's Crouch using to to send messages to Voldemort, but could it be Draco's? [13:34] <Poet> I agree Kneazly [13:34] <bemused> ... or just an owl associated with baddies? [13:34] <Expelliarmas> that could be, Kneazly [13:34] <MrMcGonagall> I wonder whether it's not the Crouch family owl. [13:34] <nympheart> That's possible MrM [13:35] <SevenofNine> Gotta run. Bye! [13:35] *** SevenofNine has quit [Bye] [13:35] <SoonerGryffindor> bye seven [13:35] <JaneMarple9> bye seven [13:35] <Kneazly> It makes more sense that it being Malfoys--Lucius seemed as surprised as any of the DE's when summoned to the graveyard. [13:35] <bemused> bye Seven [13:35] <Pellinore> Dunno... either LV has the ability to "mind meld" with creatures, which would be a way of disproving the Nagini = horcrux idea, or LV/Nagini can get really small and ride the eagle owl ;p [13:35] <Whisperwing> Well the chief of the Tayledras had an eagle owl who was very clever and wise, but we're talking Jo and not Mercedes Lackey.... [13:35] <fawkes28> i associate the eagle with someone who is bad - i see it as a sign of strength and power [13:35] <Poet> After Harry's dream, Trelawney wants him to stay so she can help him “analyze” the dream. Should Harry have done this or do you think Trelawney had other motives? (Basement Room 10 [13:36] <Pleshette> I wonder if it symbolizes in any way that the Riddle House was owned by Lucius now. THat was discussed early on in the RGs [13:36] <Expelliarmas> I found Trelawney was unseemingly excited by Harry's experience; another chance to treat him as an object [13:36] <nympheart> I think Trelawney is just obsessed with Harry and wouldn't have been able to help him [13:36] <MrMcGonagall> I think Dumbledore is of more help to Harry with this kind of thing than Trelawney. [13:36] <Kneazly> I wouldn't let T. analyze anything! She seems to love bad stuff. [13:36] <pamelitaluisa> Trelawny was drooling at the chance to interpret doom and gloom from his dream! [13:36] <bemused> - er, No, Poet - I don't think Trelawney would have contributed much [13:36] <fawkes28> i am sure she is always trying to prove herself [13:36] <fawkes28> and failing miserably [13:36] <MrMcGonagall> I agree, Pamelita [13:37] <nympheart> I think we're all agreed [13:37] <bemused> .. she might have forecast Harry's death! (again) [13:37] <Poet> Why does Harry find a connection to LV during Divination? Is it just that something significant is happening? Is it because his guard is down in his sleep? Does Trelawney's room actually hold significance for this (meaning, are there other times when this has happened in there)? (Chamber 13) [13:37] <JaneMarple9> yes Trlawney likes looking for the bad things [13:37] <JaneMarple9> in tealeaves, crystal balls etc [13:37] <Pellinore> Trelawney is a fraud until she goes into a trance ;p [13:37] <MrMcGonagall> I think it's mostly his guard being down. [13:37] <nympheart> I don't think Divination had anything to do with the connection [13:37] <fawkes28> i think his guard is down [13:37] <Expelliarmas> well, Harry certainly daydreams a lot in that class [13:37] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that trelawney might be halfway right when she says her room did it [13:37] <Pellinore> sleep [13:37] <nympheart> I agree MrM [13:37] <bemused> There might be some residual magic in the room [13:38] <Kneazly> Guard down, plus it's happening at the time [13:38] <bemused> ...or it might just be the heat! [13:38] <Pleshette> I think it's the atmosphere, hot, perfumy. It put him to sleep [13:38] *** FreedomStar has joined #lounge [13:38] <fawkes28> hi freedom [13:38] <nympheart> hi freedom [13:38] <FreedomStar> hi [13:38] <Whisperwing> I think the incense she burns may have some genuine trance-enhancing qualities [13:38] <JaneMarple9> perhaps [13:38] <Poet> Also, it's in a tower of the building, so I think the magical air is clearer up there - not so much interference from other peopel's thoughts and spells and such [13:38] <Pleshette> I don't think there's any magic to the room which led to the dream. I think the events were happening as he dreamt them [13:39] <fawkes28> that could be the most likely scenario, pleshette [13:39] <Poet> For the 2nd time in this book, Harry needed to see Dumbledore but was slowed down by the password-protected office. Why does Dumbledore stay hidden away where only certain people can reach him? (Chamber 37) [13:39] <Kneazly> I agree Pleshette. That's why it hurts H so much [13:39] <Kneazly> Yet his password is fairly easy to guess! [13:39] *** Hermeeownee has joined #lounge [13:39] <MrMcGonagall> I've always found this a little peculiar. Of course, there are a lot of precious objects in the headmaster's office. [13:39] <SoonerGryffindor> I guess for the same reason that you can't just pick up the phone and call the president [13:39] <fawkes28> just because we dont see him does not mean that he is not very involved in what is going on [13:39] <nympheart> he tends to be aloof, I was rather surprised that in SS no one knew where his office was [13:39] <Pellinore> dunno about clean air there.. maybe by the window.. with a fireplace and perfume it probably stinks and is hard to breath... no asthma sufferers in that room :p [13:40] <Poet> I assume because the students are to go their heads of house first [13:40] <FreedomStar> I think if someone needs to find Dumbledrore badly enough then he'll allow the person to come on up.. [13:40] <bemused> Don't know - it's always puzzled me [13:40] <FreedomStar> hi hermeeownee [13:40] <pamelitaluisa> I was thinking he has made it password protected with candy-related words....stuff kids can guess if they try hard enuf, as Harry does [13:40] <Poet> Then the heads of house can go to DD if necessary [13:40] <fawkes28> DD knows his school well - he said that he can become invisible [13:40] <SoonerGryffindor> Everyone might want a bit of his time so he needs to hold himself back if he is to get anything done [13:40] <Pellinore> Its probably an age old tradition. [13:40] <JaneMarple9> he likes to stay alone sometimes [13:40] <Expelliarmas> but a school headmaster typically is more involved in the daily lives of his students; i've never heard of DD having office hours [13:40] <JaneMarple9> just like sooner said [13:40] <FreedomStar> Plus, if a student really had to see him then he or she could always go see their head of house and ask to be taken [13:40] <fawkes28> i think that he prefers it that way because otherwise people act differently around him [13:41] <MrMcGonagall> I agree, Pell, that it must be part of the magic of the head's office. [13:41] <Kneazly> He does sometimes seem distant--never hear of him visiting classrooms. [13:41] <FreedomStar> Well DD is present at meals and such; he seems kinda like the principal at my school [13:41] <Pleshette> And like it was mentioned, the Heads of Houses would most likely be the ones to handle students' concerns [13:41] <Pellinore> I like the idea that there's a portrait by the entrance that warns the headmaster of someone down below that wants access. [13:41] <FreedomStar> she comes to the school events and is present and seen around campus, but if you need to see her you'll probably have to go see one of the Assitant Principals first [13:41] <pamelitaluisa> whose portrait? did I miss that? [13:41] <Poet> Because Crouch’s disappearance occurred near the Beauxbatons’ carriage, Fudge thinks Madame Maxine must be involved. Why do you think he comes to this conclusion? (Basement Room 10 [13:41] <fawkes28> i think he definitely uses the portraits, pellinore [13:41] <Pellinore> or tell someone down below that he's not in atm. [13:42] <bemused> Maybe with the portraits, the magical instruments and his own abilities he can sense whats's happening if he isn't disturbed [13:42] <nympheart> because he's prejudiced like most wizards [13:42] <Whisperwing> Because he suspects her of being a half-giant [13:42] <MrMcGonagall> Fudge knows that she's a half-giant. [13:42] <Expelliarmas> Fudge being Fudge; although at the time I found it surprising and troubling [13:42] <fawkes28> fudge is an idiot [13:42] <SoonerGryffindor> because Fudge refuses to believe that his own people could be responsible [13:42] <Kneazly> Fudge is bigoted here [13:42] <bemused> Fudge is prejudiced [13:42] <FreedomStar> because he's a prejudiced, bigheaded fart [13:42] <Whisperwing> Plus, competing school in the tournament [13:42] <Pellinore> just saying that there maybe a portrait of some headmaster outside of the gargoyle entrance that can act as an executive secretary. [13:42] <Pleshette> showing his prejudice [13:42] <nympheart> he does do that a lot, sooner [13:42] <Whisperwing> If it had happened near the lake he'd have been sure to suspect karkaroff [13:42] <JaneMarple9> Fudge is a idiot - perfect summary Fawkes! [13:42] <pamelitaluisa> This is Fudge's first outright prejudiced comment and it's chilling...sets the tone for the parting of the ways [13:43] <Hermeeownee> he just wanted to deflect it to someone that couldn't be near his people [13:43] <Pellinore> Seems like a decent suspicion but he jumps to that conclusion rather then investigates. Not a very good auror. [13:43] <Pleshette> He's incompetent and can't see beyond what looks like the obvious. Wont consider other possiblilities [13:43] <Poet> Who is correct in his assumption: Dumbledore’s thought that Fudge is prejudiced against half-giants or Fudges thought that is Dumbledore prejudiced toward half-giants? (Basement Room 10) [13:43] <bemused> It's telling that he already has his scapegoat ready [13:43] <Pellinore> DD's [13:43] <nympheart> hmm, I think those are both true to a degree [13:44] <pamelitaluisa> DD's [13:44] <Hermeeownee> was fudge an auror before becoming minister of magic? [13:44] <Pleshette> yes bemused [13:44] <Pellinore> DD = open mind, Fudge = Closed [13:44] <JaneMarple9> yep Pellinore [13:44] <MrMcGonagall> It's all on Fudge. [13:44] <Kneazly> Dumbledore is right about Fudge. DD accepts people as they are, not how he expects them to be. [13:44] <Pleshette> I like DDs comment about MM being a good dancer. [13:44] <fawkes28> fudge is definitely closed-mind, which is how i think he got to be where he is [13:44] <SoonerGryffindor> I think they both have points [13:44] <Expelliarmas> no way Fudge was an auror, too much of a coward [13:44] <FreedomStar> I agree sooner [13:44] <Pellinore> Dunno if Fudge was an auror but the job they are doing at that point is a Police/Auror/Investigator job. [13:44] <Whisperwing> Must be Fudge having the prejudice [13:44] <FreedomStar> all of these prejudices have to start from somewhere [13:45] <Pleshette> I have to slip out for a while. Hope to be back later [13:45] *** Pleshette has quit [Bye] [13:45] <MrMcGonagall> Bye, Pleshette! [13:45] <bemused> Dumbledore would judge on evidence - bye Pleshette! [13:45] <pamelitaluisa> DD is not only prejudiced "toward" half-giants, but also towards everyone else! Except LV... [13:45] <FreedomStar> the first person who met giants didn't look at them and say 'that thing looks evil, I think i'll go tell everyone' [13:45] <nympheart> DD always wants to give people a chance, and sometimes he tends to give them just a little bit too much trust [13:45] <Kneazly> I have to put some kids to bed--see you later I hope. [13:45] *** Kneazly has quit [Bye] [13:45] <Whisperwing> Being in favor of giving people the benefit of the doubt is considered being prejudiced? [13:45] <Pellinore> hehe, they probably said oooooo my... RUNNNNN splat... [13:45] <Poet> Wormtail was punished for his blunder–Crouch’s escape. He’s not the sharpest tool in the Greenhouse. Why weren’t more DEs brought into the plot by LV to help bring it about? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:45] <Whisperwing> Oxymoron, anyone? [13:46] <bemused> Bye Kneazly! [13:46] <fawkes28> i dont think he wanted anyone else to come into it [13:46] <MrMcGonagall> I think LV wanted to operate in as much secrecy as possible. [13:46] <SoonerGryffindor> because the les people who know about a plan the more odds of succe3ss that plan has [13:46] <nympheart> LV wanted to lie low, probably didn't want a lot of DEs seeing him in his weakened condition [13:46] <bemused> Perhaps because LV hadn't summoned them yet [13:46] <fawkes28> the more people, the better chances his plans would be messed up [13:46] <Poet> Because none of the Death Eaters had found LV - except Wormtail [13:46] <Whisperwing> Um, because his physical state was too vulnerable and he didn't trust a single one of them to not try to take him down and assume the power he means to have [13:46] <fawkes28> DE's aren't the smartest bunch of people [13:46] <MrMcGonagall> Exactly, Sooner [13:46] <FreedomStar> beacuse LV trusted his servant at Hogwarts, Crouch Jr. [13:46] <Pellinore> LV seems like the type of leader that deals in Need to Know theory and only includes the minimum possible to keep it secretive. [13:47] <SoonerGryffindor> here's another thing. LV may not have been 100% who he could trust [13:47] <Expelliarmas> and yet, Lucius was loyal to LV and had the money and position to make things happen for LV [13:47] <nympheart> also true sooner [13:47] <FreedomStar> and he knew Crouch Jr. would do what was necessary, killing his own father, just like LV killed his own [13:47] <Poet> It's been more than a decade since Voldemort had contact with his other DE [13:47] <bemused> Until he had a body he probably couldn't trust them [13:47] <Pellinore> good point Sooner. [13:47] <Whisperwing> Lucius did exactly wha twould most profit him both in the event VOldemort came back and the event that he was gone for good. [13:47] <pamelitaluisa> Wormtail's the only one who can dedicate all his time to LV, since the rest of the world thinks he's dead, he has no "double-life" to uphodl for appearcances. [13:47] <pamelitaluisa> *uphold [13:47] <fawkes28> and i am sure LV was still mad that some of the DE's had denied ever having been involved with him [13:48] <MrMcGonagall> considering what LV has riding on this plot, I can see him not wanting to risk anything to loose lips. He doesn't even want a vague suggestion out there that the Dark Lord is coming back. [13:48] *** dumbleydore18 has joined #lounge [13:48] <nympheart> hi dumbley [13:48] <Poet> I think he knew Crouch Jr was faithful - Crouch Jr could keep Wormtail in line if needed - It was one against one or two again one. Start adding other DE and LV could be overwlemed with DE against him [13:48] <fawkes28> also it was too soon to free those who were in azkaban - he wasnt strong enough [13:48] <dumbleydore18> hi all what was the latest question? [13:48] <JaneMarple9> hi dumbleydore18 [13:48] <pamelitaluisa> also a reason Barty Jr. was able to come on full-time for LV, everyone thought HE was dead too. [13:48] <FreedomStar> hey dumbleydore [13:48] <Poet> Why would Crouch even consider making a deal with Karkaroff? Crouch despises all Death Eaters, why let one go free? (Room 18–The Atrium [13:49] <FreedomStar> you mean from the pensieve scene, right? [13:49] <MrMcGonagall> I think Crouch would keep his word if he was negotiating. [13:49] *** cbm has joined #lounge [13:49] <FreedomStar> I don't think Crouch was actually going to consider a deal [13:49] <nympheart> In order to hopefully get even more and important DEs, I think [13:49] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that it was because he needed to get to soeone higher up [13:49] <pamelitaluisa> wasn't there a precedence for making deals with supposedly "reformed" death-eaters? [13:49] <pamelitaluisa> I'm checking... [13:49] <Expelliarmas> yes, from the Pensieve scene in the courtroom [13:49] <FreedomStar> oh wait [13:49] <bemused> In return for information on the others [13:49] <MrMcGonagall> Rookwood was a big catch. [13:49] <FreedomStar> he did let Karkaroff, right? [13:49] <cbm> Hi everyone! [13:49] <JaneMarple9> because he was worried about his son [13:49] *** Hermeeownee has quit [Bye] [13:49] <Pellinore> sometimes you have to offer a carrot to get information and sometimes the only carrot you have it a lighter sentence. [13:49] <JaneMarple9> hi cbm [13:49] <Pellinore> it = is [13:49] <dumbleydore18> maybe crouch knew some inside information on Karkaroff and wanted to hear it, or he knew that karkaroff was going to confess names. [13:50] *** HPMommy has joined #lounge [13:50] <nympheart> hi HPMommy [13:50] <dumbleydore18> I want to know why he gave karkaroff a trial if he didn't give one to other DE's [13:50] <fawkes28> hi hpmommy smile [13:50] <FreedomStar> but I think MrM is right, rookwood -was- a big catch [13:50] <Poet> It was interesting how Karkaroff was using "politically" correct terms like "You-Know-Who" and LV's supporters. Karkaroff was doing a good job of distancing himself from the other DE - and that made it easier on Crouch to accept him [13:50] <MrMcGonagall> Hi, HPMommy! [13:50] <HPMommy> Hi Everyone!! [13:50] <FreedomStar> I agree P oet [13:50] <nympheart> true Poet, he even taught in another country [13:50] <Poet> Why did Karkaroff wait so long before he claimed that Snape was a Death Eater? It seemed like a panicky last-moment decision to mention his name - why? (Chamber 37) [13:51] <HPMommy> He was grasping for something [13:51] <fawkes28> karkaroff is a coward [13:51] <HPMommy> Anything! [13:51] <nympheart> I think maybe they were a bit closer [13:51] <bemused> Snape was only a teacher - not such a big catch as Rookwood [13:51] <Expelliarmas> he was desperate and wanted to give up a big name [13:51] <HPMommy> Exactly [13:51] <SoonerGryffindor> Maybe he knew that DD had already vouched for him, or maybe he was scared of SNape [13:51] <Poet> I agree bemused - and Snape was amibiguous [13:51] <fawkes28> DE's always try to save their own skin [13:51] <JaneMarple9> Karkaoff was a teacher [13:51] <cbm> Maybe he knew what Snape's mission was [13:51] <JaneMarple9> Hi there HPMommy [13:51] *** SoonerGryffindor has quit [Bye] [13:51] *** SoonerGryffindor has joined #lounge [13:52] <nympheart> I wonder what kind of rank Snape had after overhearing the prophecy? He may well have been a huge name. [13:52] <dumbleydore18> the thing that i said about that was the fact that he maybe wanted to be dramatic about it, say only a few names a day and then hit crouch with the good ones; crouch jr and snape...etc. [13:52] <MrMcGonagall> I think he was scared of Snape, Sooner. I don't think Karkaroff ever intended to turn "good" if he got out of prison, and Snape is an enemy you wouldn't want to have. [13:52] <Pellinore> Maybe Karkarof was friends with Snape at some point so left his name till last. [13:52] <SoonerGryffindor> exactly Mr M [13:53] <MrMcGonagall> Mention lesser DEs first, and move up the ladder if you need a "bigger" name to convince Crouch. [13:53] <Whisperwing> He probably expected to be able to turn to Snape for protection once he got out, and turning him in killed that possibility. [13:53] <cbm> Snape is ambiguous, so maybe he was just as confused to his loyalty as the rest of us are? [13:53] <fawkes28> i dont picture the two of them ever being "friends" snape doesnt trust many people at all [13:53] <JaneMarple9> Snape is a good person to be scared of [13:53] <HPMommy> what I wonder, is if LV kept his DE identity a secret, how much information do any of them really have on each other [13:53] <fawkes28> good point, cbm [13:53] <bemused> But Rookwood as a Ministry wizard wouldn't be a lesser DE - he'd be a big name [13:53] <Poet> Do you believe Bagman didn’t purposely pass information to the Death Eaters? Was he really duped or was he a willing participant? (Room 18–The Atrium [13:54] <HPMommy> So Duped! [13:54] <pamelitaluisa> duped [13:54] <FreedomStar> I say he wa s really duped [13:54] <Whisperwing> I think he was a dunderhead [13:54] <nympheart> I think he was being honest [13:54] <HPMommy> He's not that bright [13:54] <JaneMarple9> He was a little....silly [13:54] <HPMommy> LOL Whisperwing [13:54] <FreedomStar> I agree HPMommy [13:54] <SoonerGryffindor> I think he really is that stupid [13:54] <fawkes28> exactly he is not that smart [13:54] <Expelliarmas> I think he was a willing participant and got paid for his info to pay for his gambling addiction [13:54] <MrMcGonagall> I agree, Sooner [13:54] <bemused> It may be a telling point that the chair didn't chain Bagman - it chained Karkaroff and the others [13:54] <Whisperwing> Like thinking he could get away with paying goblins in leprechaun gold [13:54] <Pellinore> Duped, fairly stupid guy that has lots of popularity/fame so he didn't need to go DE to gain glory [13:54] <JaneMarple9> agreed Mommy he's not the brightest person in the world [13:54] <pamelitaluisa> ah, an old gambling connection... good point! [13:54] *** PolythenePam has joined #lounge [13:54] <Whisperwing> Oh he was still quite the sports figure at that time, wasn't he? [13:55] <cbm> I have not problems believing bagman is an idiot [13:55] <Poet> I think he was duped, but if Voldemort hadn't fallen, I think Bagman would have ended up in a position where he'd have known what he was doing and he would be blackmailed to keep doing it. [13:55] <Whisperwing> He was congratulated on that win during the testimony [13:55] <Expelliarmas> he was in a great position to pick up information, folks would tell him anything because he was a popular celebrity [13:55] <nympheart> I think Bagman's a DE in in HBP, but he was just dumb in the first war [13:55] <Whisperwing> So I don't think he got into gambling until the end of his Quidditch career [13:55] <nympheart> true Expie [13:55] <MrMcGonagall> I think Rookwood found himself a good tool. [13:56] *** cbm has quit [Bye] [13:56] <Poet> What do you think about the way Crouch Sr. treated his son in the courtroom? What about his wife's reactions, first to the trial and then to her husband's pronouncement? (Chamber 13 [13:56] <pamelitaluisa> very dramatic [13:56] <Expelliarmas> Sr. should have immediately recused himself from sitting in judgment of Jr. [13:56] <fawkes28> he cares more about his job than his family [13:56] <nympheart> more cruel than necessary [13:56] <bemused> Scary! [13:56] <FreedomStar> agreed expie [13:56] *** cbm has joined #lounge [13:56] <Pellinore> agree Expie [13:56] <pamelitaluisa> agree should have recused himself [13:56] <MrMcGonagall> I agree, Expie. [13:57] <FreedomStar> too many family ties [13:57] <HPMommy> It was his son's cry for attention and he sure got it! [13:57] <SoonerGryffindor> in the muggle world that would not have been allowed [13:57] <Poet> Crouch Sr. should not have been running that trial. There was a jury, but still..... [13:57] <FreedomStar> that was what brought him down in the eye of the wizarding world [13:57] <pamelitaluisa> but he was fanatical at the time, and blinded by ambition? [13:57] <fawkes28> he is harder on his own son than on others - BCS was not objective [13:57] <MrMcGonagall> I think Crouch wanted the credit for casting the Lestranges into prison [13:57] <HPMommy> Makes you wonder about ethics in the Wizarding world. [13:57] <SoonerGryffindor> its another thing that goes to show you how inconsistent the justice system is in the wizarding world [13:58] <HPMommy> How could he Judge his own son's trial if you could call it that [13:58] <Expelliarmas> Sr. was anxious to disassociate his house from the Dark Arts. [13:58] <Expelliarmas> he had a motive to be harsh [13:58] <dumbleydore18> i think it was sad...I mean i can't imagine being a mother and seeing your son in the state he was in...it woudl be sick to me if crouch jr. was faking his reaction just to get attention and notice, but I don't see this as likely. It broke my heart to see him screaming and his mother. What really got me was when his father said "you are no son of mine". [13:58] <Whisperwing> Well how would you react if you were in a similar position, say a prosecutor, and your child got tagged as a mass murdering serial killer? [13:58] <fawkes28> exactly BCS should not have been allowed to be there in a position of power [13:58] <Poet> Do you think Crouch Jr. helped torture the Longbottoms with the Lestranges? Was he a faithful DE already when he was sentenced and his panicky pleading was just an act, or did his stay in Azkaban and the house arrest harden him and feed his hatred? (Chamber 37) [13:58] <JaneMarple9> it was a hard thing for Crouch to do [13:58] <fawkes28> i wouldnt put it past him [13:58] <cbm> I think that crouch is an example of what happens when ambition is more important than family [13:58] <JaneMarple9> he was a faithful de yes [13:59] <nympheart> I don't think he helped torture, but I'm sure he was there and a faithful DE [13:59] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that is was an act [13:59] <HPMommy> I feel he probably got mixed up with the wrong crowd but then once convicted wanted reveng on his father [13:59] <FreedomStar> he was a DE, and he did help torture the longbottoms [13:59] <Whisperwing> VOldemort would never have thought him his most faithful if he'd come by his dedication after being falsely incarcerated. This post has been edited by fawkes28: Feb 3 2007, 03:10 PM |
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Feb 3 2007, 02:58 PM
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Organizing the Halo Rebellion Posts: 3,301 Joined: 2:09pm April 16, 2006 Location: Being angelic, of course |
[13:59] <cbm> I think he was guilty as charged
[13:59] <Poet> When Crouch Jr gets taken out of Azkaban to his father's house - his father wasn't able to get him under control without the impervious - I think that shows that Crouch Jr. indeed had been a very loyal supporter of LV [13:59] <SoonerGryffindor> I really do think that he did the horrible things. [13:59] *** PolythenePam has quit [Bye] [13:59] <bemused> I think he was guilty, but every time I read that scene I do wonder [13:59] <pamelitaluisa> a faithful de at the time, maybe too young to do any effective torturing [14:00] <nympheart> His fear at the trial makes me think he was innocent of that particular crime, he was loyal to LV, claimed he didn't do it, and was unpunished by LV [14:00] <Poet> I think he sought out the DE and joined them to spite his dad. [14:00] <cbm> He lied about being a DE, so why would he not lie about the Longbottoms [14:00] <HPMommy> Me too Poet [14:00] <bemused> I'd agree with that, Poet - he seems to see LV as a substitute father [14:01] <MrMcGonagall> I think he was there and helped torture the Longbottoms. He was every bit as insane in his loyalty to LV as the Lestranges. [14:01] <Poet> All those years in his Dad's house, his Dad was never able to turn him good, despite what his Mother had hoped [14:01] <dumbleydore18> When I read it that passage Crouch jr seemed to be the only one that was really scared externally and internally. I can't help but think that Crouch jr. went along for the ride but meant no harm. I think he was just there to be there, with no intentions of actually torturing them. But then I think about if crouch jr was being tooooooo dramatic and by that it was fake. [14:01] <nympheart> I'm not sure Sr. made much effort there, Poet [14:01] <cbm> Poet, how could he be turned good when he was never himself [14:01] <Expelliarmas> i think his insane loyalty comes forward as a result of azkaban and being under house arrest [14:01] <bemused> I wonder if that scene is also meant to put readers off the scent [14:01] <nympheart> agreed, dumbley [14:02] <bemused> ... so that we don't guess the part Crouch jnr is playing [14:02] <Poet> We finally learn what happened to Neville’s parents. What’s worse? Harry’s situation of never knowing his parents or Neville’s situation of having his parents never really know him? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:02] <pamelitaluisa> neville's is so sad [14:02] <Whisperwing> Wow imagine if Hermione had meant to cast IMpervious on Harry's glasses and wound up Imperio'ing him instead.... [14:02] <bemused> Neville's situation [14:02] <nympheart> Neville's is worse [14:03] * cbm is having sever lag problems and may leave if it does not get better [14:03] <pamelitaluisa> haha whisperwing! [14:03] <FreedomStar> I can't say [14:03] <dumbleydore18> I agree nevill'es is worse. [14:03] <Whisperwing> Especially if, as soime of us suspect, he was there the night they were tortured [14:03] <fawkes28> i think neville's is worse because he can still see his parents and probably to some degree still has hope that they will go back to the way they were [14:03] <Pellinore> wouldn't want either of them and couldn't even begin to choose between them. [14:03] <cbm> Both are so horible it is unimaginable to me what it would be like [14:03] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that Neville's sitution is worse because he has to face the harsh reality of his parent's fragility. Harry at least has had a chance to romanticize his parents in his thoughts [14:03] <HPMommy> I can't choose. They're both horrible situations [14:03] <Expelliarmas> to know his parents are alive and that they loved him, but are no longer with him--what a horror [14:03] <pamelitaluisa> not that Harry's isn't sad (my mother's an orphan), but at least he gets to envision them as they were, young and happy [14:03] <HPMommy> But I think Harry's is worse [14:03] *** Aislinn has joined #lounge [14:03] <fawkes28> hi aislinn [14:03] <bemused> At least HAry knows his parents didn't suffer [14:04] <MrMcGonagall> To have the constant reminder that Neville does would have to be painful. [14:04] <HPMommy> I feel just knowing there still alive would give me comfort [14:04] <Aislinn> Hi smile [14:04] <bemused> Hello Aislinn! [14:04] <cbm> I think Harry's is worse because he never new the truth [14:04] <MrMcGonagall> Hi, Aislinn! [14:04] <nympheart> hi Aislinn [14:04] <Poet> Neville continually grieves for his parents - he seems them at their worst - in a death-like state for years [14:04] <FreedomStar> hey aislinn [14:04] <Expelliarmas> Heya, Aislinn [14:04] <cbm> Hi Aislinn [14:04] <SoonerGryffindor> hi Aislinn [14:04] <pamelitaluisa> and Neville doesn't share his predicament with others, so he doesn't get sympathy either [14:04] <Poet> When you found out about Neville’s situation, what were your thoughts? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:05] <fawkes28> sad [14:05] <pamelitaluisa> sad [14:05] <SoonerGryffindor> Its hard to separate out my thoughts here from knowing the information I know in the next book [14:05] <bemused> Pity for him - and understanding of why he is as he is [14:05] <nympheart> something like "wince" [14:05] <Aislinn> It can be harder to have a loved one alive but in a state such as Nevile's parents are, than it is to lose them altogether [14:05] <Expelliarmas> it was heartbreaking [14:05] <dumbleydore18> It still, to this day, breaks my heart. [14:05] <Whisperwing> Where was Neville was my immediate first thought [14:05] <MrMcGonagall> Poor Neville. As if he didn't already have enough to be getting on with. [14:05] <cbm> I was unsure what to think, it did not all fit until OotP [14:05] <fawkes28> i felt worse for neville than i did for harry [14:05] <bemused> Yes, Aislinn, it is [14:05] <FreedomStar> my first thought was "how do you carry around a secret like that for so long?" [14:06] <fawkes28> none of the kids really knew neville's story - he is keeping all of this inside of him - it is terrible [14:06] <dumbleydore18> agreed WW, where was Neville? Find out in book 7 i guess [14:06] <FreedomStar> I mean honestly, how did he keep it from everyone? [14:06] <Aislinn> It is sad that he never felt close enough to any of them to confide the information about his parents [14:06] <nympheart> I think Neville prefers it that way [14:06] <cbm> maybe he did not want sympathy, I felt sad for him [14:06] <FreedomStar> maybe it just never came up [14:06] <fawkes28> how do you bring that up in a conversation? neville is not one to go around telling everyone [14:06] <Aislinn> I probably didn't, cbm [14:06] <FreedomStar> i'm sure if someone had asked he would've answered [14:06] <Aislinn> he, I mean [14:07] <pamelitaluisa> at the time (prior to OotP), it brought a whole new dimension to Neville's bumbling character [14:07] <nympheart> He's introverted, doesn't seek attention, and just seems to not want to discuss his personal life [14:07] *** Poet has quit [Bye] [14:07] <fawkes28> exactly nymph [14:07] *** Poet has joined #lounge [14:07] <FreedomStar> he doesn't give out more information than he needs to [14:07] <Whisperwing> Well they do know since meeting him in St Mungoes [14:07] <bemused> He also has to cope with his gran and her expectations - and her attitude to his parents [14:07] <Poet> How do Pensieves work? How accurate are the memories? Just how much can those memories be manipulated? Are there any signs that these memories have been changed or skewed? (Chamber 13) [14:07] *** Whisperwing has quit [Bye] [14:07] <pamelitaluisa> oooh, I wish I had one [14:08] <Poet> I think we can be fairly certain that the memories are very accurate [14:08] <cbm> I did not catch any. [14:08] <bemused> I think the memories have to be accurate - there'd be no point, else [14:08] *** Whisperwing has joined #lounge [14:08] <nympheart> Apparently the memories are infallible as long as they are not deliberately tampered with or possibly if it is an old memory from someone who was very young [14:08] <Whisperwing> And the tampering is easily detected [14:08] <Poet> When asked, Jo said that the memory even shows things that the person couldn't see [14:08] <fawkes28> i think the memories are objective unless you manipulative them [14:08] <MrMcGonagall> I don't think that the memories can be easily modified so as to avoid detection. Jo says they are an accurate picture of the real scene, which seems hard to believe, but there it is. [14:08] <cbm> There were no descriptions that matched the inaccruate memories in HBP [14:08] <dumbleydore18> neville's grandmother is a whole other chat....i dislike her so much, i can't help but feel that she is putting her guilt of the longbottoms onto neville. [14:08] <Poet> Though we've seen that someone can badly edit out parts of their own memories [14:09] <SoonerGryffindor> I think of it as being able to watch a video surveillance camera [14:09] <Whisperwing> So it's a bit like a time travel within a bubble of memory [14:09] <fawkes28> only slughorn's memory seems to have been manipulatived [14:09] <pamelitaluisa> I think they are accurate recordings - and I'd love to pull out really old ones to see what I'd missed as an observer of my own memory! [14:09] <nympheart> we know that Slughorn couldn't very well alter a memory in a rush [14:09] <FreedomStar> that's a really good description sooner [14:09] <cbm> How about a 3d video camera, I like that [14:09] *** cloudpic has joined #lounge [14:09] <Poet> Dumbledore says, “I was using the Pensieve when Mr. Fudge arrived for our meeting and put it away rather hastily. Undoubtedly I did not fasten the cabinet door properly. Naturally, it would have attracted your attention.” Was it an accident or was Harry meant to look into the Pensieve? (Basement Room 10) [14:09] <bemused> let's hope there's a whole library of memories we haven't seen yet!! [14:09] <FreedomStar> lol cbm [14:09] <FreedomStar> hi cloudpic [14:10] <nympheart> The memories have to be a huge plotpoint, as from a psychological standpoint the way they function doesn't make sense [14:10] <FreedomStar> I believe it was an accident [14:10] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that thre is a very good chance that this was not an "accident" [14:10] <cbm> I thinnk it was an accident [14:10] <Expelliarmas> heya, cloudpic [14:10] <nympheart> I think DD was trying to get his attention there [14:10] <fawkes28> i dont think it was an accident [14:10] <FreedomStar> Not even DD could foresee that Harry would be coming to visit after Fudge [14:10] <Whisperwing> A hologrammatic vid, like in Star Wars or in ST:TNG when Tasha Yar made that holocrystal for Data [14:10] <Expelliarmas> I think it was on purpose [14:10] <fawkes28> i think DD knows how curious harry is [14:10] <bemused> But would DD lie? [14:10] <cloudpic> Hi, all... I "vote" that Dumbledore did it deliberately [14:10] <Pellinore> DD seemed to have a very ready explenation for what happened, but it could very well have been an accident. [14:10] <MrMcGonagall> I don't think it was intended. I think it was an accident, but DD doesn't seem upset that Harry has seen the memories. [14:10] <pamelitaluisa> I wondered why the trial memories were the first Harry fell into...were those the last ones DD was viewing? [14:10] <FreedomStar> but how could DD have known that Harry would be coming? [14:10] <dumbleydore18> well we know for a fact that memories can be changed...slughorn did it too his memories, but I don't think they can be changed after being put into the pensieve, more information can be found on a particular memory (as harry did), but can't be changed once in the pensieve. [14:10] <nympheart> even if Harry didn't fall in himself, I think DD wanted to provoke a question [14:11] <Expelliarmas> DD has been giving Harry combat training throughout the series [14:11] <fawkes28> DD likes to give Harry chances - to test him [14:11] <Whisperwing> Did Harry have the Invisibility Cloak with him at the time, worn or not? [14:11] <pamelitaluisa> good question freedomstar [14:11] <Poet> Did Dumbledore come back to his office and pull Harry out of the Pensieve straight away, or did he come in, saw what Harry was doing and decide to let him watch? If so, why? (Chamber 37) [14:11] <Whisperwing> If he did, that could be how Dumbledore expected him. [14:11] <nympheart> DD doesn't tell the whole truth that often actually, bemused [14:11] <cloudpic> I wondered how Dumbledore knew harry was in there... [14:11] <FreedomStar> I believe DD came into his office, saw the pensive, and decided to drop in with Harry [14:11] <SoonerGryffindor> I had never thought of it that way [14:11] <Aislinn> I bet he let him watch for a bit [14:12] <nympheart> I think DD let Harry see a bit more, and I wonder how long DD was in there with him before speaking [14:12] <FreedomStar> and then when he thought Harry had seen enough, he suggested thta they leave [14:12] <cloudpic> Why not just put it away... and Harry'd have been stuck? [14:12] <Poet> I think it would be wise to let Harry finish out part of whatever memory he was watching - rather than trying to explain what he missed later [14:12] <cbm> I think he pulled him out straight away, but then I do not think it was an accident. [14:12] <Expelliarmas> He let him watch; part of his training [14:12] <FreedomStar> cloudpic, I wondered the same thing [14:12] <pamelitaluisa> thanks this was fun - bye! [14:12] <SoonerGryffindor> now that I think about it, I'm thinking that maybe he did let him watch [14:12] <fawkes28> good question [14:12] <SoonerGryffindor> bye peamelitaluisa [14:12] <FreedomStar> bye pamelita [14:12] <Pellinore> wouldn't suprise me, if someone's in the pensive if it doesn't glow or do something that gives it away to anyone who walks by. [14:12] <nympheart> bye pamelita [14:12] *** pamelitaluisa left #lounge [] [14:12] <Pellinore> or maybe you can hear the sound coming out of the pensive from what's going on. [14:12] <Expelliarmas> DD fully expected Harry to do what he did; he knew where to look for Harry [14:12] <dumbleydore18> DD let harry watch the memory, if DD cared about what harry was seeing then he would have gone over to harry and pulled him out ASAP. Then there is the concideration that DD had no clue what Harry was looking at. I just have a feeling that DD let harry look. [14:12] <MrMcGonagall> It's hard to say. I think DD did let him watch for a while. [14:13] <FreedomStar> maybe anytime a memory plays it shows up like a hologram on top of the pensive, like when DD showed Harry Bertha Jorkins [14:13] <FreedomStar> so he saw that a memory was playing and assumed that Harry had fallen in [14:13] <SoonerGryffindor> that is a good observation [14:14] <cloudpic> Will we be considering later why that memory was one Dumbledore was "studying"? [14:14] <fawkes28> i think curiosity is an important trait for our hero to have [14:14] <Pellinore> or the person only feals like they are "in" the pensive when in physical reality they are only bent over with their face stuck in the cloud. [14:14] <nympheart> Harry had to look into the bowl though [14:14] <cloudpic> Yeah... that makes sense. [14:14] <Poet> The memory of Snape that Dumbledore swirls out of the Pensieve seems to show Snape confiding in Dumbledore about the Dark Mark becoming stronger. What does this scene tell you about where Snape’s loyalties lie? Does it change your opinion at all? (Basement Room 10) [14:14] <dumbleydore18> oooo maybe DD left harry there because he wanted Harry to look into the pensieve. He left it unlocked as he left, kind of hinting to harry....it's open its okay if you look through it. [14:14] <cloudpic> Oh, Pellinore! I'd not thought of that [14:14] <JaneMarple9> Hi Cloud! [14:14] <fawkes28> hehehe smile [14:14] * cloudpic waves to Jane [14:15] <FreedomStar> no comment on this question- snape's loyalty is one thing I just can't get my head around, so I tend to not give opinions [14:15] <fawkes28> i think it is important that we see snape confiding in DD [14:15] <bemused> I think it shows he's loyal to DD - then, at least [14:15] <SoonerGryffindor> I think it was very interesting that Harry's face turned into Snape's face [14:15] <nympheart> I think Snape was anxious, indicating he's either loyal to DD or playing both sides [14:15] <cbm> Dumbledore says he could of made the connection himself, if Snape knew that also it tell nothing [14:15] <Whisperwing> You know, the fact that he showed it to Dumbledore, and probably before Karkaroff came to him about it, tells me Snape's been loyal to DD\ [14:15] <Aislinn> I think that Snape may have been on Dumbledore's side at this point in the story, or at least leaving his options open. [14:15] <bemused> Yes - sooner [14:15] <cloudpic> I thought that letting Harry see that was to confirm to Harry that Dumbledore knows all about Snape and still trusts him. [14:15] <fawkes28> although at this point we have no idea how important snape is to the overall plot of the series [14:15] <nympheart> true cbm [14:15] <MrMcGonagall> It tells me that right now Snape prefers to be under DD's wing than bank on the possibility of LV coming back. [14:15] <Whisperwing> Fawkes, are you taking the mickey? [14:16] <fawkes28> i think the dark mark may have made snape a little bit frightened [14:16] <Pellinore> Snape may have realised from Harry that LV was getting stronger so decided its not information worth keeping from DD. Snape is such and enigma.. you can arger for or against his loyalty easily. [14:16] <Whisperwing> I should think we have quite a good idea how important Snape is to things [14:16] <bemused> and we dp smile [14:16] <dumbleydore18> I still have mixed feelings about snape so i think i will read other's thoughts. [14:16] <fawkes28> he doesnt always show what he feels [14:16] <bemused> *do [14:16] <fawkes28> and i think he wanted to confide in someone [14:16] <Pellinore> doh.. arger = argue tongue [14:16] <fawkes28> he cant necessarily confide in just anyone [14:16] <JaneMarple9> It's enough to make anyone frightened, the dark mark [14:17] <nympheart> why not Karkaroff then, fawkes, why DD? [14:17] <cbm> The problem with finding the loyalty of a spy is he must appear loyal to both sides. So Snape if snape was loyal to Voldemort and knew that Dumbledore knew the mark was getting stronger, he would be abliged to tell Dumbledore also, It is a vicious circle [14:17] <fawkes28> i doubt he trusted karkaroff at all [14:17] <FreedomStar> because karkaroff is a sissy [14:17] <cloudpic> Oh, good point nympheart... [14:17] <fawkes28> maybe snape was also covering his basis with DD wink [14:17] <Aislinn> yes, cbm, you're absolutely right [14:17] <JaneMarple9> yes perhaps Karkaoff should had confided in Dumbledore? [14:17] <Poet> Why does Dumbledore allow Harry to witness something that might potentially undermine his (apparently trusted) Potions Master? Even more, knowing that this might only create more speculation, why would he choose to not reveal the full story? (Chamber 007) [14:18] <cloudpic> But there were other DE's besides Karkaroff.. he could have gone to someone else... but it was Dd [14:18] <Aislinn> wow, what a great question [14:18] <JaneMarple9> he wanted Harry to know [14:18] <nympheart> Harry would find out one way or another [14:18] <JaneMarple9> yes Nymph [14:18] <SoonerGryffindor> I think maybe that Dumbledore knows Harry needs to start learning this information [14:19] <cbm> The full story is something that Dumbledore never wanted Harry to know. He never wanted Harry to know that Snape was the person who started the chain of events that led to his parent's death [14:19] <JaneMarple9> he wanted Harry to know some facts and find out some by himself - with Ron and Hermione to help [14:19] <Aislinn> I think that Dumbledore trusts Harry implicitly, so would not be concerned at this point about allowing him to see this information [14:19] <SoonerGryffindor> and that the information would be something that would be better coming from him rather than someone else [14:19] <MrMcGonagall> DD seems to be trying to show Harry how to put pieces of a complicated puzzle together. [14:19] <bemused> I think the full story is something private, between DD and Snape [14:19] <Pellinore> I would NOT say that it undermined Snape.. in fact it helped assuage harry's fear of Snape... Harry had just witnessed Snape being called a DE at the trial and was brought up by Harry as why he was trusted. Now you see Snape show the Mark to DD as an act of trust. [14:19] <fawkes28> i think he only wanted to give him enough information to help him - all he wanted was to keep harry happy [14:19] <dumbleydore18> Dd knew that Harry disliked Snape and that harry might take that memory into his own hands. [14:19] <Expelliarmas> I've wondered about this a lot; perhaps DD knows the connection between Harry and LV could make Snape vulnerable if Harry knew the truth [14:19] <cloudpic> hmmm... a little knowledge is a dangerous thing usually applies.. but here it seems like Dumbledore wanted to reassure Harry that he knew what was going on [14:19] <SoonerGryffindor> very good point Pellinore [14:19] <Aislinn> that's a good point, Pellinore [14:19] <Poet> I agree Expelliarmas [14:20] <Expelliarmas> i.e., the connection between them would endanger Snape [14:20] <bemused> Good point, Pellinore [14:20] <cloudpic> Besides... we aren't to "know" the whole story either! [14:20] <Pellinore> I agree Expe [14:20] <fawkes28> exactly, cloudpic [14:20] <nympheart> Harry's a smart kid, he'd notice if DD ignored to topic completely andif he found out on his own, he'd be more suspicous [14:20] <Pellinore> So many things DD could have told Harry but that may very well have been like calling LV up and telling him directly. Makes for more suspensful series anyway when the Hero doesn't get all of the information. [14:21] <Expelliarmas> so long as Harry suspects Snape, LV will not know which way Snape leans [14:21] <cbm> We will not know the whole story for another 169 days [14:21] <cloudpic> So it's a nice balance, I agree nympheart [14:21] <Aislinn> that's a really good point, expie [14:21] <Poet> When Harry had first entered DD's office, Dumbledore gave Harry one of his "swift, searching" looks. Was this Legilimency or not? (Chamber 37) [14:21] <nympheart> I think so [14:21] <Expelliarmas> definitely legilimency [14:21] <cloudpic> I don't think so. [14:21] <MrMcGonagall> No. [14:21] <bemused> I think so - but I know no one else does wink [14:21] <cbm> I think so. I think Snape and DD do this almost all the time [14:21] <nympheart> I think DD was at that point just trying to figure out why Harry was there and if it was urgent [14:21] <Whisperwing> More reading his body language [14:21] <Aislinn> I don't think it was [14:22] <fawkes28> i think so too, www [14:22] <cloudpic> We've said that Dumbledore respects others... that'd have been an invasion... I think he can just "read" people after all these years [14:22] <Aislinn> I don't think that Dumbledore uses Legilimency except in extreme circumstances [14:22] <cloudpic> I agree Whisperwing [14:22] <Poet> I think it was Legilimency and that DD was trying to get an idea of why Harry was in his office so when DD could be prepared when he returned [14:22] <SoonerGryffindor> I do not think that it was. I think it was DD knowing who Harry is as a person and looking into his eyes as one muggle would to another [14:22] <MrMcGonagall> I agree, Aislinn. [14:22] <fawkes28> harry shows his emotions far too much - dumbledore can read him so well without invading his mind [14:22] <Aislinn> I agree, cloudpic - I don't see him as invading someone's privacy unless it was REALLY important [14:22] <dumbleydore18> I don't think that DD used Legilimency on Harry. [14:22] <cloudpic> The "Mom" look [14:22] <cbm> It is not like the deep attack we see in OotP, but I think it is just the same [14:22] <cloudpic> lol [14:22] <nympheart> lol cp [14:23] <Poet> I think he may not have been doing it very strongly, but I think DD is always able to "see" a little [14:23] *** bemused has quit [Bye] [14:23] *** bemused has joined #lounge [14:23] <nympheart> agreed Poet [14:23] <Expelliarmas> I don't hold DD that high up; I think he uses legilimency to get an idea of where Harry and others are [14:23] <cloudpic> Maybe like his "sensing" magic in the cave? [14:23] <dumbleydore18> Harry was in a panick and maybe DD wanted to read harry's feelings, but not look into his mind. [14:23] <fawkes28> DD is not like Snape - DD respects Harry [14:23] <Aislinn> I think that they have a trusting relationship, and DD performing legilimency on Harry like that would undermine that trust [14:23] <SoonerGryffindor> I think if I found out that DD had used Legilimacy against Harry at any point in time I would be a bit disappointed [14:23] <cbm> that is a good analogy cloudpic [14:23] <Poet> I like that idea cloudpic [14:23] <cloudpic> I guess I rank Dumbledore with Atticus Finch in the respecting privacy area... [14:23] <dumbleydore18> What I want to know is that moments after DD went with Fudge to go search the ground...did DD know where to look? [14:23] <Poet> Bertha saw someone kissing "Florence" behind the greenhouses and got hexed for it. Whom do you think she saw? (Room 18--The Atrium) [14:24] *** Pleshette has joined #lounge [14:24] <MrMcGonagall> I'm sure legilimency is related to picking up nonverbal signals, but I don't think DD was trying to read Harry's thoughts [14:24] <bemused> I wish I could find the quote - there are several times when the description of DD's gaze sounds far stronger than normal [14:24] <HPMommy> I love that question [14:24] <cbm> Sirius [14:24] <Aislinn> I think that DD is a good enough judge of character and behavior to be able to recognize whether someone is lying or not, merrely through body language [14:24] <MrMcGonagall> Was it Sirius? [14:24] <Poet> I have no clue, but I think it was someone that we know - [14:24] <cloudpic> I'm with you, Aislinn [14:24] <Pellinore> I would almost expect it Sooner. DD can be very distant at times and getting to the truth of something rather then relying on a kid's inability to vocalise what happened can be a great boone. [14:24] <cloudpic> Sirius.. the ladies' man? [14:24] <SoonerGryffindor> It could have been Snape [14:24] <cbm> I have no idea, it just struck me as something sirius would do [14:24] <nympheart> I think Sirius had too much fun hanging around with the Marauders to care about girlss [14:24] <HPMommy> I was thinking Snape [14:25] <Aislinn> I suspected that as well, sooner [14:25] <Expelliarmas> ewww, Sooner; but I think you might be right, he's a "hex" kinda guy. [14:25] <HPMommy> LV is older [14:25] <MrMcGonagall> Me too cbm. [14:25] <cloudpic> hmmm... Snape the ladies' man? [14:25] <Poet> I agree that back in Book 4, I did think it was Snape [14:25] <nympheart> In SWM Sirius ignored the girls looking at him [14:25] <Poet> I'm not so sure now. [14:25] <JaneMarple9> Snape a ladies man? laugh [14:25] <HPMommy> LOL [14:25] <dumbleydore18> was it a jelous wormtail? I can have so much fun with this question lol [14:25] <Poet> Snape would certainly hex someone who saw that smile [14:25] <JaneMarple9> Nope for me...more interested in potions [14:25] <cbm> He was being too cool to look at the women [14:25] <SoonerGryffindor> well, Florence could have been a Millicent Bulstrode [14:25] <bemused> Sirius maybe - or James???? [14:25] <cloudpic> Well, there are some who think is pretty hotte right now! [14:26] <Expelliarmas> that's true, or a pugsy parkinson [14:26] <MrMcGonagall> Sirius talks about what a bigmouth Bertha was in school. I think he had some experience of her tattling tongue. [14:26] <bemused> ... we'd have to know what Florence looked like! [14:26] <JaneMarple9> ok sooner...Florence????? [14:26] <nympheart> I think all of the Marauders did MrM [14:26] <cbm> good connection MrM [14:26] <cloudpic> I'm leaning that way too Mr. McG... Sirius seems more... is bold the right word? [14:26] <JaneMarple9> reckless? [14:26] <Aislinn> self assured, yes, cloudpic [14:26] <nympheart> Perhaps Remus? [14:27] <Poet> Ron and Hermione help Harry prepare. Each contributes differently to Harry's preparation. What does this say about what the Trio has learned about working as a team? (Basement Room 10) [14:27] <cloudpic> Both! yes, Jane and Aislinn [14:27] <bemused> Don't think Remus would have hexed [14:27] *** FreedomStar has quit [Bye] [14:27] <HPMommy> I think if you have a reputation as being a gossip, you don't have to actually been the focus of it [14:27] <cbm> In happy times they are an excellent team [14:27] <Poet> I love the fact that Ron is willing to be stunned over and over for Harry's benefit [14:27] <cloudpic> It's progress... but I think at this stage it comes in the category of "unconscious competence." [14:27] *** Whisperwing has quit [Bye] [14:27] <nympheart> Hermione does the research, Ron provides the support to whatever cost to himself, and Harrry's the one with the action [14:28] <bemused> Ron suffers, Hermione comes up with the ideas [14:28] <SoonerGryffindor> Yet again Ron is the one to sacrifice himself [14:28] <MrMcGonagall> Each of them do bring their strengths to the table to help Harry. [14:28] <Pellinore> TEAMWork! yea smile.. finally they start jel'n as a team. Makes me worry about ron's future through [14:28] <Expelliarmas> They have learned to work efficiently with each other [14:28] <Expelliarmas> yes, he's the one getting zapped by Harry's spell [14:28] <dumbleydore18> that working as a team is better than working alone. that working as a team makes each person stronger. Working with three brings all their flaws together and makes them whole...united as one. [14:28] <Poet> Yes, when Hermione is asked to take over as stunnee, then she says that she thinks Harry's got it pretty much already [14:28] <MrMcGonagall> Once again Hermione is not the "action" girl. [14:28] <fawkes28> this book is a turning point in a lot of ways and i think it holds true for the trio's relationship [14:29] <Pleshette> Lol Poet, I love that part [14:29] <Expelliarmas> well, truth be told, i wouldnt want to be the stunnee, either [14:29] <Aislinn> I think that they represent 3 aspects of a whole, and this shows how this has become an integral part of their relationship [14:29] <cbm> That was a great moment [14:29] <MrMcGonagall> Expie is much more of a disarming person. biggrin [14:29] <JaneMarple9> yes Hermione and Harry practising was cute [14:29] <cloudpic> lol, Mr. McG [14:30] <nympheart> very much, Aislinn [14:30] <Poet> What part does Sirius play in Harry's preparation this time? Harry feels more prepared for this task. What important strategies did he learn from the first two tasks? (Basement Room 10) [14:30] <cbm> Was it because Hermione did not want to be stunned or had she let Harry go on longer than needed to torment ron? [14:30] <dumbleydore18> Ron has courage and strength and encourages others, Hermione has the book smarts, and Harry is the go getter...he does things and goes to action, which gets him into trouble sometimes with not thinking things through. This is where Ron comes in bringing Harry back down to the ground. [14:30] <Poet> Sirius actually becomes a bit of the voice of reason for this 3rd task [14:30] <nympheart> I loved Sirius in GoF, he plays the father well in this one [14:30] <Expelliarmas> Sirius actually acts more like a parent in this one [14:30] <fawkes28> sirius is just trying to protect harry like a son [14:31] <JaneMarple9> Yes Nymph [14:31] <bemused> I agree, nympheart [14:31] <Aislinn> yes, fawkes, I agree [14:31] <Pellinore> Harry seems to go to his friends more for help rather then sit on an egg. [14:31] <cbm> He gives the exact advice I could see James giving Harry [14:31] <MrMcGonagall> Sirius has been great throughout the TWT. [14:31] <JaneMarple9> only time he was a father figure [14:31] <cloudpic> He's learned to trust his first impulses... as long as he has a body of knowledge to select from [14:31] <Pleshette> Sirius is really worried for Harry's safety. He calls it "his priority" [14:31] <nympheart> I think Harry got self-confidence from the first task and humility from the second. [14:32] <Aislinn> yes, pleshette - that seems to be his main focus throughout this year [14:32] <Poet> Harry briefly entertains the notion that the Dursley's may have come to watch him. What's going on there? Could he have wanted their support? (Basement Room 10) [14:32] <cloudpic> Oh... well put nympheart [14:32] <dumbleydore18> the most important thing I think harry has learned is to get to the preparation asap. I can't help but believe that by sirius helping harry out was a kick in the butt for harry to get going on the practice. Harry realised how important it was for sirius becauese sirrius cared. [14:32] <dumbleydore18> brb [14:32] <MrMcGonagall> No way. It was just shock. [14:32] <Pleshette> and he has great faith in DD's ability to keep Harry safe [14:32] <cloudpic> I shuddered for the boy [14:33] <cbm> I think he was imagining the Dursleys in hogwarts, the would be ... I can not even come up with the words to use [14:33] <bemused> I think he'd have been pleased - once he'd recovered from the shock [14:33] <nympheart> lol, cbm, that would have been hilarious [14:33] <cloudpic> Yeah... but it does show us that he considers the Dursleys to be "his family" might mean something for Deathly Hallows [14:33] <Pleshette> I think so too Mr.McG [14:33] <nympheart> nice catch, cp, that protection still functions at this point [14:33] <Aislinn> Oh, I don't think he was looking for their support - I think he was genuinely confused by the comment of family coming [14:33] <cloudpic> If it had just been Petunia, I'd have "bought it" but not Vernon or Dudders [14:34] <cbm> Or cloudpic, it might be that he thinks that others consider the dursleys his family [14:34] <fawkes28> i think harry always hopes for a family who is blood-related to him - but he knows better now that family doesnt mean blood [14:34] <Pleshette> But it's interesting that they were his first thought when "family" was mentioned [14:34] <Expelliarmas> Harry has truly given up on any thoughts of the Dursleys ever being on his side [14:34] <Poet> How did Molly and Bill end up coming to Hogwarts for this event? Did Dumbledore suggest it? Or were they coming anyhow? (Basement Room 10) [14:34] <nympheart> I think they may have asked DD to come [14:34] <Pleshette> I think DD probably invited them [14:34] <cbm> I think it was DD's idea [14:34] <Pellinore> Seems Harry was lothing the idea of seeing the Dursleys anywhere near Hogwarts. Would be an embarresment to him. [14:35] <cloudpic> Maybe they asked... having Percy prattle on about it at home?? [14:35] <bemused> I think it was their idea - the know how isolated he is [14:35] <MrMcGonagall> I wouldn't be surprised if DD suggested they come. [14:35] <bemused> *they [14:35] <cloudpic> Though I really wondered why it was Bill particularly [14:35] <Pleshette> He wanted Harry to have support and Sirius couldn't be there [14:35] <SoonerGryffindor> I dont think that even Dumbledore would have been able to keep Molly away [14:35] <cbm> I think that bill was the only one available, plus we had to have Bill and fluer meet smile [14:35] * cloudpic figures we'll never really know. *sighs* [14:35] <Aislinn> I think that Molly probably made it known how badly she felf that Harry was alone, and offered to come [14:35] <nympheart> possibly, cp, because Bill hasn't done much, GoF brought the two older Weasleys in, and Charlie was there for the first task [14:35] <Pleshette> I agree cbm [14:36] <cloudpic> JKR has to keep characters "in our heads" [14:36] <Poet> What did you think of Amos Diggory's treatment of Harry at the Champions Family meet and greet? Not a very good sport or an overly devoted dad? (Chamber 007) [14:36] <dumbleydore18> most definately DD supported it. He knows how much of an affectr the wealsyes have on Harry. I think it was great. [14:36] <Pellinore> DD probably asked the Dursleys or sent a letter and they refused so they looked for an alternative family. may also have been his head of house McGonagall... Hey MrM ask your wife ;) [14:36] <SoonerGryffindor> I think that Cedric handled it very well [14:36] <fawkes28> i think he wanted so badly for his son to beat harry [14:36] <Pleshette> No it wasn't. Very disappointing. [14:36] <Expelliarmas> oh, not a good sport at all [14:36] <nympheart> It's one thing to support your kid, but to verbally attack Harry is different [14:37] <MrMcGonagall> Both, Poet. Amos makes my blood boil. Rudeness! [14:37] <bemused> Thought Amos was really unpleasant - so did Cedric - but it's awful reading that oand knowing what will happen [14:37] <cloudpic> No... maybe JKR was making a point about poor sportsmanship on the part of parents [14:37] <cbm> He was the sports dad that makes any son cringe, I met of few of them when I played sports [14:37] <Aislinn> I think that it was a bit unfair of Amos to treat Harry that way, but he was understandably upset at the way his son's glory was stolen away by the circumstances and the press [14:37] <HPMommy> I think he's a bit of both. He's ultra competitive and supportive of his son as far at being rude! [14:37] <Poet> I think he was caught up in the events. He was not nice at all. Reminds me of some people after big football games [14:37] <Aislinn> He had no right to take it out on Harry though [14:37] <cloudpic> It did show Cedric's nobility [14:37] <cbm> luckily my dad was in no way like that [14:37] <Pleshette> Good point Aislinn [14:37] <SoonerGryffindor> I remind myself that Amos attittude was because he loved his son [14:37] <nympheart> true, cloudpic, we saw a nice contrast there [14:38] <Expelliarmas> Amos never accosted Rita, though that we know of ... [14:38] <dumbleydore18> I think both. He wanted his son to win, but was too carried away with past encounters; ravenclaw beating gryffindor in quidditch, that he was just only thinking of his son. A very jolly man, with some attitude I think. [14:38] <Aislinn> yes, sooner, he was extremely proud of his son, and had every right to be [14:38] <MrMcGonagall> I think you're right Ann. Not right to dis Harry, but the press did ignore Cedric and the attention due him. [14:38] <fawkes28> it just goes to show us that adults can act like children sometimes [14:38] <Aislinn> and yes, Expie - he should have taken it out on Rita [14:38] <nympheart> I hink Amos wanted to believe it was Harry trying to get back at Cedric for beating him [14:38] <bemused> Once you know he's about to lose Cedric, it's heartbreaking [14:39] <dumbleydore18> I don't think Amos meant any harm...we knew from the start that Amos adored his son so much. [14:39] <Poet> I think he forgot that Harry is just a boy, and he hasn't seen what good Harry has done for Cedric - the Daily Prophet is saying bad stuff about Harry as well [14:39] <cbm> I agree Aislinn, but I remember in Football practice a dad acting exactly like him and pointing out why his son should have no problems blocking me. It reminds me so much of mr. diggory, it is the face I place with the character [14:39] <Poet> What about Molly’s comments that Rita Skeeter goes out of her way to make trouble. But she falls for it too after the Witch Weekly article. If she believed it, then why was she so snippy toward Hermione. (Chamber 007) [14:40] <nympheart> I think it's just because she is unbelievably attatched to Harry [14:40] <bemused> Maybe it's that she's thinking of when she tells Amos off... [14:40] <Expelliarmas> Molly was as blinded toward Harry as Amos was toward Cedric [14:40] <Poet> I see a tiny similarity between Molly's treatment of Hermione and Amos' treatment of Harry [14:40] <cbm> The written word, even when written in a rag like that, is usually believed [14:40] <Aislinn> excellent point, expie [14:40] <MrMcGonagall> Yes, Molly should practice what she preaches. [14:40] <SoonerGryffindor> What is interesting is that Molly was blasing Amos for doing the same thing to Harry that she did to Hermione [14:41] <Pleshette> I was disappointed in her reaction. She should know Hermione well enough to know it wasn't true. [14:41] <Poet> We see this situation getting worse in Book 5 - people listening to the Daily Prophet too much instead of finding out the truth of people's character for themselves [14:41] <bemused> ... maybe she's learnt from her mistake [14:41] <cbm> So both of them believed parts of the articles [14:41] <dumbleydore18> I think it has to do with the fact that Hermione is a girl and being a mother of boys she tends to watch girl interists very closely. [14:41] <Pellinore> It is VERY easy to read an article and not really check the author. Believe the article then read who wrote it and go.. aw nuts it all garbage or not even see the author at all. [14:41] <nympheart> true, Pleshette, but Molly needs flaws [14:41] <Pleshette> I think she did bemused [14:41] <Expelliarmas> That's quite true, Pleshette; AMos at least could say he didnt know Harry [14:41] <Aislinn> yes, Poet - it becomes rampant [14:41] <cloudpic> Molly's human. I think she is as likely to be mislead... especially by emotional issues as any of us. [14:41] <cloudpic> LOL... a human witch ;) [14:41] <Pleshette> But maybe it's because of the distance...she's at home, they're at school...not knowing what's really going on [14:42] <cloudpic> That would make me crazy, Pleshette... [14:42] <Pleshette> me too [14:42] <Poet> Where was the oleaginous Snape while the other teachers patrolled the exterior of the maze? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:42] <cbm> She could send an owl and ask, though I wonder what Ron's answer would be [14:42] <cloudpic> LOL oleaginous! [14:42] <dumbleydore18> what does oleaginous mean? [14:42] <cloudpic> Was he watching Karkaroff? [14:42] <cloudpic> oily [14:43] <Pleshette> Where's the Handy College Dictionary? wink [14:43] <bemused> I wondered that too, Poet - good word!!! [14:43] <nympheart> perhaps sitting back preparing to enjoy watching Harry being miserably defeated [14:43] <cbm> No idea, he is with Ginny somewhere as they are both off-camera [14:43] <Poet> Where's the shampoo? [14:43] *** NCMcGonagall has joined #lounge [14:43] <Pellinore> http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/oleaginous [14:43] <dumbleydore18> I think he was CP, or he wasn't doing anything [14:43] <MrMcGonagall> It means greasy git. [14:43] <JaneMarple9> CP? [14:43] <cloudpic> Or did he suspect Moody? [14:43] <Pleshette> heeheehee [14:43] <JaneMarple9> ah CloudPic [14:43] <Aislinn> It is surprising that he wasn't patrolling with the others [14:43] <dumbleydore18> thanks pellinore [14:43] <cbm> I think that no one suspected moony [14:43] <Aislinn> He is typically right in the middle of that type of activity [14:43] <nympheart> I don't think so, cloudpic, "Moody" scared him off [14:44] <cloudpic> I suspect Dumbledore wanted him in reserve [14:44] <Poet> I think he was IN the maze [14:44] <bemused> Crouch/Moody seems to take his place by DD in this story - until the end [14:44] <SoonerGryffindor> maybe he was patrolling, but BCJ made sure he was on anohter side of the perimiter [14:44] <nympheart> interesting Poet [14:44] <cloudpic> Or he didn't "volunteer" so he was free to keep an eye on the larger picture [14:44] <Poet> spyder ;) [14:44] <Pellinore> np, i had to look that one up myself.. good find on the word btw, love to learn new stuff smile [14:44] <MrMcGonagall> Yes, I don't think that he would have volunteered to patrol with Moody. [14:44] <dumbleydore18> I have to go...taking cats to vet. I has been fun....see you for P3 tomarrow!!!!!! [14:44] <Expelliarmas> maybe he was watching the alarmingly clearing Dark Mark on his arm [14:44] <Pleshette> Bye dumbleydore! [14:44] <nympheart> but you know that the other headmasters would complain about Hogwarts cheating [14:44] <Aislinn> bye dumbleydore [14:45] <dumbleydore18> bye [14:45] *** dumbleydore18 left #lounge [] [14:45] <Pellinore> is there a chat at 7 tonight? [14:45] <bemused> bye dumbleydore [14:45] <Poet> No Scribbulus tonight [14:45] <Aislinn> nope [14:45] <Poet> If a champion sent up red sparks, essentially quitting the tournament ... then is that a breach of the magically binding contract to compete? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:45] <Aislinn> there is not a chat tonight [14:45] <Expelliarmas> bye dumbleydore18 [14:45] <JaneMarple9> perhaps yes [14:45] <Pleshette> No I don't think so as they've entered the maze to compete [14:45] <cloudpic> Not if it was a direct part of the rules of the maze segment surely [14:45] <MrMcGonagall> I don't think that it is the same as quitting the TWT [14:45] <bemused> Maybe not, because they've already tried and failed - it's not like backing out without trying [14:46] <nympheart> I don't think it would be if there was a reason they had to drop out, like injury, as they did try their best [14:46] <Poet> No, I don't think it's quitting the tournament - just finishing their third task badly [14:46] <cbm> No, they tried there best, I think it would be if they took one step into the maze and did that [14:46] <cloudpic> I think that was a part of the protection from having deaths... alas, it didn't work. [14:46] <Pleshette> Fleur left the lake before finishing the 2nd task [14:46] <Pellinore> Evidently not.. i would assume breach of magical contract would imply something more horrible then Edgecrombie's "SNEAK" [14:46] <Poet> For task 2 Fleur didn't.... right [14:46] <fawkes28> Only 15 minutes left, everyone! This has been a great chat! I want to remind you all that this transcript can be found at the Corner Booth Forum http://www.leakylounge.com/Corner-Booth-f184.html. [14:46] <Aislinn> it was part of the instructions, and the task was underway, so I don't think it was a breach of anything [14:46] <cbm> she did try though, so I assume she did her best and failed [14:47] <Expelliarmas> I wonder about that--what if the person throws up sparks to voluntarily quit? That's no longer competing and you are magically bound to compete [14:47] <cloudpic> Right, Expie... that'd have been a different story. But we've seen no sign of flat-out cowardice in any of the champions. [14:47] <cbm> Let's say your leg is broken and a skewt is coming after you, should you allow yourself to be eaten, or throw up sparks [14:48] <Poet> I don't think the sparks are a magical way of changing your contract - I think it's just a way to get other people to come save you [14:48] <cloudpic> Sparks! [14:48] <bemused> The spraks were a signal that a champ was in difficulty and wantedrescue - maybe they could arry on after thae [14:48] <Pellinore> What i wonder is if the contract wasn't just with the Name written on the paper but had to be written BY the person like a signature. So BCjr would have had to have torn a signature Harry made off of a test or something. [14:48] <bemused> * - er sorry [14:48] <Poet> Each of the items in the maze tested Harry differently. Within the maze, how did each of the challenges test Harry? These were the challenges: boggart, mist, skrewt, Sphinx, spider. (scollins, Room 18–The Atrium). [14:48] <nympheart> I think so bemused, remember Cedric sparked for Viktor [14:49] <Pellinore> no true puzzles but the mist came close [14:49] <cloudpic> boggart = courage [14:49] <nympheart> Sphinx is the easy one, logic [14:49] <Expelliarmas> the mist seems to be a test of logic [14:49] <cbm> mist = bravery [14:49] <Aislinn> he needed to be able to see through an illusion for both the boggart and the mist [14:49] <cloudpic> Sphinx = logic [14:49] <Poet> The Sphinx was a bit like the potions riddle in Book 1 - logic [14:49] <Pellinore> er, yea i guess the Sphinx would be a puzzle duh [14:49] <bemused> mist is about trusting what you know, and not what you perceive [14:49] <Aislinn> the mist was a leap of faith [14:49] <Poet> The boggart tested fear [14:49] <JaneMarple9> sphinx is obviously logic yes [14:49] <cloudpic> Oh, agreed Aislinn... and bemused [14:49] <Aislinn> skrewt was pretty straightforward defensive skills [14:50] <MrMcGonagall> Many of them were fighting different types of fear. [14:50] <Pleshette> skrewt..yes Aislinn [14:50] <Poet> So it tested his logic, faith, fear, bravery, teamwork, determination [14:50] <cbm> The mist was a jump into the unknown, I think you have to be brave to make that leap [14:50] <Aislinn> the sphinx was logic [14:50] <Expelliarmas> the spider would be teamwork as two people were necessary to defeat [14:50] <Expelliarmas> it [14:50] <cbm> yep poet [14:50] <nympheart> yes, Aislinn, combined with strategy as you had to hit the soft spot [14:50] <JaneMarple9> remind me is this the chapter when the goblet is a portkey again? [14:50] <Pleshette> Yes Jane [14:50] <nympheart> I wonder how a single champion would have stood a chance against the acromantula? [14:51] <Pellinore> Fear, Faith, Strategy, Logic, Strategy? [14:51] <Poet> What did you think of Cedric’s struggle with whether to take the Cup himself? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:51] <cbm> Wasn't the soft underbelly the only shot Harry had [14:51] <cloudpic> And trusting someone [14:51] <Pellinore> Would have to tie up leggs in some manner [14:51] <SoonerGryffindor> I think it was awesome [14:51] <Aislinn> I thought it was so admirable [14:51] <JaneMarple9> he was fighting his deserve to win [14:51] <cloudpic> Loved it... and expected it too [14:51] <nympheart> agreed, Aislinn [14:51] <Expelliarmas> he wanted it so badly; and yet he didnt give into the temptation [14:51] <JaneMarple9> or to help harry [14:51] <cbm> He is definately not his father's son [14:51] <Aislinn> He really stopped to think about it and weigh his options, and made the noble choice [14:51] <bemused> shows what a decent person he was [14:51] <Pleshette> Wonderful...such an honorable guy [14:51] <Pellinore> Cedric was a better man then his father. [14:52] <Poet> ....And what would it have meant for the Hufflepuffs for Cedric to have won the Tournament? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:52] <cloudpic> Hogwarts champions are definitely all "Nobility R Us" [14:52] <nympheart> the world [14:52] <bemused> Everything, Poet [14:52] <Pellinore> hehe [14:52] <JaneMarple9> It would had meant notarity [14:52] <Expelliarmas> it would have given them glory and respect [14:52] <Aislinn> LOL cloudpic [14:52] <Pleshette> Glory of which they hadn't had in a loooooooong time [14:52] <MrMcGonagall> Big party in the Hufflepuff Common Room [14:52] <cbm> Pride for their house, but I think they should be proud anyway [14:52] <cloudpic> I'm not sure they didn't get as much "boost" from learning of Cedric's murder by LV [14:52] <Pleshette> lol [14:52] <JaneMarple9> gryffindor and slytherin are always doing things note worthy [14:53] <JaneMarple9> while Ravenclaw are studiers [14:53] <Aislinn> I think it would have been such a wonderful means of them finally getting respect they probably feel they have not been afforded for years [14:53] <JaneMarple9> Huffles are ....nobodies sad [14:53] <Expelliarmas> and ravenclaws are known for their smarts; it would have helped them distinguish themselves as a house [14:53] <Pleshette> Cedric's name would have gone in Hogwarts A History: revised edition [14:53] <bemused> that's a bit hard, Jane [14:53] <cloudpic> Not anymore, Jane. I think Cedric changed that forever. [14:53] <Pellinore> they're the left overs the other houses didn't want ;o [14:53] <Aislinn> I don't view them as nobodies, Jane [14:53] <MrMcGonagall> lol, Pleshette [14:53] <HPMommy> Hufflepuff's are faithful friends, very supportive [14:53] <JaneMarple9> smile little harsh sorry [14:54] <fawkes28> loyalty is a very important trait [14:54] <JaneMarple9> hufflepuffs aren't very notable [14:54] <cbm> Huffies value teamwork, teamwork is extremely important to me [14:54] <JaneMarple9> don't put themselves forward [14:54] <HPMommy> Nice attribute [14:54] <cloudpic> The choice of Cedric from Hufflepuff seemed so deliberate... by the Goblet or Jo... to point up that "anyone" is a potential hero [14:54] <JaneMarple9> quiet [14:54] <Pleshette> And sadly it might still, for different reasons sad [14:54] <Poet> How fair a compromise was it that Harry and Cedric take the Cup together? Do you feel one of them deserved to win more than the other? Who? Why? (Basement Room 10) [14:55] <nympheart> I think it was a perfect Square Deal [14:55] <JaneMarple9>  all Hufflepuffers hug[14:55] <cloudpic> Seemed right somehow. [14:55] <cbm> I think that they both thought the other should win [14:55] <Pellinore> it was a fair compromise between both of them. [14:55] <JaneMarple9> they both deserved to take it [14:55] <cloudpic> It took Harry up a notch in my estimation [14:55] <Pleshette> To both of them it was fair which is what matters [14:55] <nympheart> with an unfortunate end [14:55] <fawkes28> i thought they both deserved it but now i wished they didnt touch it i [14:55] <MrMcGonagall> No, I think they both deserved it, although part of me was wishing just Cedric would take the Cup, considering what happened next. [14:55] <cloudpic> Oh, yes! fawkes! [14:55] <Poet> By sharing it, it makes them both more deserving of having it - ironic, huh? [14:56] <bemused> It was fair - but I wish the spider had touched it first (or the skrewt) [14:56] <JaneMarple9> oh yes Fawkes [14:56] <Pellinore> hehe bemused [14:56] <JaneMarple9> wrong move sad [14:56] <fawkes28> everytime i reread, i keep hoping they dont grab it [14:56] <cbm> very true poet [14:56] <Expelliarmas> oor fake Moody [14:56] <Poet> Did the spectators actually “see” the Third Task? Had the event been visible, why didn’t anyone do something when Cedric and Harry apparated? (FredFan, Room 18–The Atrium). [14:56] <cbm> It showed the noblity of bot of them [14:56] <Aislinn> I think it was such a Harry thing to do - to look for the greater good, the win-win solution(last question) [14:56] <cloudpic> That has soooooo driven me nuts [14:56] <cbm> both [14:56] <nympheart> I don't know! I keep wondering that. [14:56] <JaneMarple9> no they didn't see it [14:56] <JaneMarple9> i don't think so anyway [14:56] <cloudpic> How could that huge crowd of preteens and teens sit quietly not seeing anything happen??? [14:57] <Expelliarmas> I don't think they saw a thing [14:57] <Pleshette> I don't think they saw it [14:57] <Aislinn> I don't think the spectators saw the second or the third task [14:57] * cloudpic thinks snogging may have helped pass the time [14:57] <nympheart> If they can't see, why use the Quidditch stadium? [14:57] <Poet> No one saw it except fake Moody. I think it had to be that way [14:57] <Pleshette> good question for JKR cloudpic [14:57] <JaneMarple9> the task was taken inside the maze [14:57] <SoonerGryffindor> LOL [14:57] <cbm> If the task could have been seen, then Barty's actions would have been obvious [14:57] <fawkes28> lol [14:57] <Expelliarmas> LOL cloudpic, you're soo bad [14:57] * Poet passes cloudpic some Valentine candy [14:57] <cloudpic> LOL [14:57] <JaneMarple9> but i think the spectators saw task one and two [14:57] <bemused> Was the cup meant to carry the winner out of the maze? [14:57] <cloudpic> Thank you. hee hee [14:58] * JaneMarple9 passes cloudpic some chocolates! [14:58] <nympheart> Probably, bemused [14:58] <cloudpic> I wondered about that, bemused... it seems to have [14:58] <Poet> I think they couldn't see any of task two , but at least it was a bit more interesting than the maze [14:58] <Pellinore> My guess is that the Cup/Portkey had to be made special to allow it to port out of Hogwarts grounds... and was made to port from the center of the maze out to the crowd. But BCjr. redirected it to the graveyard. [14:58] <JaneMarple9> it was meant to bemused [14:58] <cloudpic> Yeah, that makes sense Pellinore [14:58] <JaneMarple9> but it was tampered with sad [14:58] <Expelliarmas> DD had to ask the mercheiftess to tell him what happened below; so the spectators didnt see a thing [14:58] <Poet> I agree Pellinore [14:58] <Aislinn> I don't think the cup was meant to be a portkey at all [14:58] <cbm> 2 was underwater, so they could only see the entry and exit from the water as DD had to talk to the merpeople to find out what happened [14:58] <Pleshette> I don't think it says specifically, but that seems the logical thing [14:59] <cloudpic> Yes. And we saw how distressed Percy and Fleur were [14:59] <Pellinore> otherwise a piece This post has been edited by fawkes28: Feb 3 2007, 03:04 PM -------------------- |
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