ReadingGroup Corner Booth Transcript Apr 14, 2007, Chapters 11,12 from OotP |
 Apr 14 2007, 02:10 PM
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Chief Cat Herder  Posts: 3,514 Joined: 10:28am August 6, 2005 Location: In the Corner Booth - home of the elusive Holy Grain!    |
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[12:57] *** Aislinn has joined #lounge [12:59] *** Snuffles changed the topic to: Open Reading Group chat on Order of the Phoenix (Aislinn) [12:59] *** fawkes28 has joined #lounge [12:59] *** Leeg has joined #lounge [12:59] *** cbm has joined #lounge [13:00] <cbm> hi [13:00] <fawkes28> hi leeg and cbm [13:00] <Leeg> hi [13:00] <Leeg> hi [13:01] <fawkes28> everyone excited for the weekend? [13:01] <cbm> Yes [13:01] <Leeg> should be good, and you? [13:02] *** MrMcGonagall has joined #lounge [13:02] <fawkes28> yes, i am - but i have been off work for a week [13:02] <fawkes28> hey Mr. M [13:02] <Leeg> not well? [13:02] <cbm> I hope you had a good week! [13:02] <fawkes28> spring break - i teach [13:03] <fawkes28> i have - hoping monday doesnt come too soon [13:03] *** JaneMarple9 has joined #lounge [13:03] <Leeg> wow coolsmile [13:03] <JaneMarple9> Hello all! [13:03] <fawkes28> hi Jane [13:03] *** Sophia40 has joined #lounge [13:03] <Aislinn> hello! [13:03] <MrMcGonagall> Hi, everyone! [13:03] <Sophia40> hi to all [13:04] *** PrincessPickledOnion has joined #lounge [13:04] <Leeg> hey [13:04] <PrincessPickledOnion> Hey everyonesmile [13:04] <fawkes28> hi sophia and PPO [13:04] <Sophia40> hows the weather around the planet [13:04] <Sophia40> Hi fawkes [13:04] <fawkes28> still cool [13:04] <PrincessPickledOnion> Hey fawkes!! Its sunny and warm! [13:05] <fawkes28> bring some of that weather my way [13:05] <Leeg> UK -fairly warm..now thats a surprise. [13:05] <Sophia40> Northwest US patchy clouds some sun yeah [13:05] <PrincessPickledOnion> yeh leeg! It is isn't it!! We'll huff and puff some your way fawkes biggrin [13:06] <PrincessPickledOnion> Which part are you in leeg? [13:06] <cbm> It is nice here today, but tomorrow is going to be rainy [13:06] <MrMcGonagall> It is cold and rainy in Oklahoma today, but at least we're not getting the snow that is just north of here. [13:06] <Leeg> smile [13:06] <PrincessPickledOnion> oh lord! that's lucky! [13:06] <fawkes28> i was just in the Northwest, Sophia [13:06] <Sophia40> Snow in April BRRRRRRRR [13:06] <Leeg> Near towards Manchester, if you know where it is, Mr M. looks like you need some of the UKs weather [13:07] <Sophia40> Fawkes yea Where? [13:07] <fawkes28> Seattle [13:07] <PrincessPickledOnion> I'm in south wales leeg so i reckon we'll need to think up some plan to share the sun biggrin [13:07] <fawkes28> How's the weather in the UK in the summer, Leeg? [13:07] <Sophia40> Cool I live an hr from there [13:08] <PrincessPickledOnion> Depends lol - pretty unpredictable! It was boiling last summer though - England had a hose-pipe ban [13:08] <JaneMarple9> yes last summer in england was glorious [13:08] <fawkes28> warm is good - i hate cold weather [13:08] <Leeg> smile sounds fun [13:08] <JaneMarple9> not as hot as the summer of 2003 though - that was a hot one! [13:09] <Leeg> yet in england we get our fair share of rain [13:09] <Sophia40> Warm is definately great thinkin about moving south for warm [13:09] <JaneMarple9> smile oh yes, we get the rain too! [13:09] <PrincessPickledOnion> Yes *nods in horror* I dislike the summer because if you get too hot you can't cool down... [13:09] <fawkes28> i always think about heading south too [13:10] <fawkes28> maybe i'll move to oklahoma and go bug someone there laugh [13:10] <PrincessPickledOnion> Well i'm on best-mate terms with rain seeing as im from wales. we get some sun tho which is nice yeah [13:10] <Aislinn> yes, PPO, I'd rather be cold than too hot [13:10] *** TheMadMuggle has joined #lounge [13:10] <fawkes28> hello TheMadMuggle [13:10] <cbm> me too aislinn [13:10] <Aislinn> you can always grab a sweater or blanket, but when it's hot, I'm just miserable [13:10] <Sophia40> I was thinkin New Mexico [13:10] <TheMadMuggle> hey [13:10] <fawkes28> warm is better [13:10] <PrincessPickledOnion> Yeh Aislinn my way of thinking... you can throw on as many jumpers as you like biggrin [13:10] <Leeg> i agree with that [13:10] <Aislinn> exactly! [13:11] <PrincessPickledOnion> snaparoo [13:11] <fawkes28> why am i always on the opposite side of the fence as you all? [13:11] <MrMcGonagall> I just talked to poor SoonerGryffindor. She's freezing her butt off at a soccer tournament [13:11] <PrincessPickledOnion> We love you anyway fawkes [13:11] <Aislinn> because you have no natural padding, fawkes laugh [13:11] <PrincessPickledOnion> Oh lord!! [13:11] <cbm> Fawkes, warm as in 80 or 20 is good, but 90 is bad [13:11] <MrMcGonagall> It's true. fawkes needs more natural padding. [13:11] <PrincessPickledOnion> My natural padding fails lol [13:11] <fawkes28> hahaha, Aislinn - you are so very funny [/sarcasm] [13:11] <MrMcGonagall> Yes, I don't like it when the temp gets above 80 F [13:12] <fawkes28> 90 is nice and toasty [13:12] <MrMcGonagall> I'm much more of a sweater person than shorts. [13:12] *** TheMadMuggle has quit [Bye] [13:12] <PrincessPickledOnion> if your a stuffed chicken [13:12] <Sophia40> 90 sounds bone warming to me [13:12] <cbm> I don't like being toasted [13:12] <fawkes28> see, Sophia and I get along just fine [13:12] <PrincessPickledOnion> seranaded - yes. Wined 'n' dined yes... toasted? naaa [13:13] <fawkes28> i would be happy with above 80 degrees all year [13:13] <Aislinn> ugh [13:13] <PrincessPickledOnion> dont wish too hard.... the way 'climate change' is going it will be [13:13] <PrincessPickledOnion> Lol Aislinn [13:13] <MrMcGonagall> fawkes definitely lives in the wrong part of the US [13:13] <Sophia40> Me too Fawkes I love the out doors and that helps [13:14] <fawkes28> i do - i need to fly myself south [13:14] <Leeg> id be happy with it colder, so i can put on my cosy sweaters [13:14] <PrincessPickledOnion> Fly me to the moon... and let me play amongst the stars.... [13:14] <Sophia40> Danrango Colorado is nice all year! [13:14] <JaneMarple9> i don't like too much sun either [13:14] <MrMcGonagall> I like a change of seasons, so I need some variation in temperature throughout the year. [13:14] <JaneMarple9> I like it warm but with a breeze! [13:15] <Aislinn> We will be starting the discussion in a few minutes. You're not going to be able to type for a few minutes while we make some announcements, please bear with us, you'll be able to type again soon. [13:15] <Aislinn> There may be times during the chat when a moderator will want to PM something to you. Please keep an eye on the top of your screen, right next to the button with #Lounge on it. A button will appear with one of the mods' names on it. If you see that appear, click on it to see the PM that has been sent to you by that mod. [13:15] <Aislinn> You won't be able to reply to that PM, but if you could just say something like "Sooner, got it" in the main chat, to let us know that you have seen it, that will be great. We'd also like to remind you that the rules of the Lounge also apply here in the Corner Booth, and may be found here: http://www.leakylounge.com/?act=rules [13:15] <Aislinn> If you need to contact us during the chat, send one, or all, of us a PM on the Lounge. We will be checking them regularly, but if we haven't replied after a little while then please let us know here that you have sent a PM. Thanks for your cooperation! [13:16] *** TheMadMuggle has joined #lounge [13:16] <Aislinn> While its easy to drift off in various directions, let's all try to have a fun chat by sticking to the topic for today. OK, moving on to the topic for the chat! [13:16] <fawkes28> Harry sits nervously in the no-longer-horseless carriage - knowing that Luna sees the horse-things too is no consolation - while the others wonder where Hagrid is and argue whether he's a good teacher. Hagrid's not at the staff table. Harry recognizes Umbridge (“the Toad”) at the staff table. The Sorting Hat sings a new song and covers the history of the founders, best friends who eventually fell out. The hat fears it's sortin [13:16] <fawkes28> Dumbledore welcomes back the students and Grubbly-Plank, who is teaching Care of Magical Creatures (no mention of Hagrid), and introduces the Toad as the new DADA teacher. Umbridge hem hems and bores almost everyone spitless by giving a buzzword-filled speech. Hermione manages to listen and translates the waffle: the Ministry is interfering at Hogwarts. [13:16] <fawkes28> Back at Gryffindor Tower, Harry gets up to his dorm where he learns Seamus’ mam believed the Prophet and did not want him to return to school as she worries about that nutter–Harry Potter. Harry has a go at Mrs. Finnegan and they argue. Neville and his Gran believe Dumbledore and Harry. [13:16] <fawkes28> The first day of school is awkward as Dean can’t explain Seamus’ attitude. Seamus isn't the only one, Lavender thinks he’s a nutter too. Hermione puts Harry in his place for continuously popping off at Hermione and Ron. The day gets worse ... double Potions where he gets his first zero of the term courtesy of ol’ greaseball. Divination stinks too (but that’s not surprising). [13:17] <fawkes28> The steady decline continues with DADA. After reviewing the class aims, It tells the students to read for the rest of the class period. (There’s the mark of a fabu teacher–no actual teaching!) Hermione, Ron, Harry, Dean and Parvati challenge the Toad. Umbridge insists the students raise their hands and continues speaking in a sickly-sweet voice and treating them all like ickle five-year olds. [13:17] <fawkes28> It ends with Harry blowing up at Umbridge and calling it a liar. The Toad insists Cedric’s death was just some accident. Harry is sent to McGonagall. McGonagall is shocked to see Harry, but shocks Harry by offering him a biscuit when he admits that he shouted at the Toad. McGonagall warns Harry about crossing Umbridge, reminding him of where it comes from and what the Ministry has been doing all summer. [13:17] <fawkes28> Thanks to Chamber 88 and Chamber 29 for the introduction. All caught up? Good, let’s chat about Chapters 11 and 12. [13:17] <fawkes28> Neville has seen the thestrals for awhile. Why have the students not even heard of the thestrals before this year? (Chamber 88) [13:18] *** Hermeeownee has joined #lounge [13:18] <Sophia40> Because it is from Harry Life [13:18] <JaneMarple9> not something Neville would talk about [13:18] <PrincessPickledOnion> its only been central to the plot now.... no real need before hand i spose [13:18] <cbm> maybe they are not taught until year 5 [13:18] <JaneMarple9> Neville has a few secrets - about his parents etc - so he wants to keep his private secrets to himself [13:19] <MrMcGonagall> I wouldn't think they'd be taught very early in the CoM class. [13:19] <fawkes28> Jo needed to introduce things slowly - can't introduce everything in the first book [13:19] <JaneMarple9> don't think so cbm - only people who have seen people die, can see thestrals i believe [13:19] <MrMcGonagall> And thestrals would be difficult to study, I think, if most students can't even see them. [13:19] <Aislinn> I agree, jane - Neville wouldn't volunteer the information [13:19] *** Leeg has quit [Bye] [13:19] <Sophia40> I expect the fact that the box are written from Harrys perspective has some thing to do with it [13:19] <PrincessPickledOnion> Not only that - the other books needed to hold certain things - if Jo had introduced Thestrals before 5 than she might have had to cut down on important stuff [13:19] <fawkes28> well, they didn't even have CoM until their third year [13:20] <fawkes28> so two years later isn't that far off [13:20] <cbm> They do have the lesson in them later in the book [13:20] <JaneMarple9> neville tries to keep in the background [13:20] <Sophia40> Oh sorry I ment BooksLOLOLO [13:20] <fawkes28> and Hagrid was busy teaching them about other wild creatures and flobberworms [13:20] *** Leeg has joined #lounge [13:20] <JaneMarple9> they were introduced in CoMC so Hagrid could tell the class about them [13:21] <JaneMarple9> it helped Ron and Hermione realise that Harry was "seeing things" [13:21] <PrincessPickledOnion> lol [13:21] <JaneMarple9> wasn't not was [13:21] <fawkes28> Why did Dumbledore permit himself to be interrupted? Did this serve a strategic purpose? (Chamber 88) [13:21] <JaneMarple9> just to show us what Umbridge was going to be like! [13:22] <fawkes28> DD is so kind really [13:22] *** kittie69 has joined #lounge [13:22] <JaneMarple9> Kind smile [13:22] <PrincessPickledOnion> Yes - show everyone the difference between this woman and the other teachers on his staff.... plus he's polite and a real gentleman [13:22] <fawkes28> maybe he wanted to gain greater insight into her evile nature [13:22] <MrMcGonagall> He's not one to make a scene, and I think he was caught off-guard, too. [13:22] <JaneMarple9> yes good point [13:22] <PrincessPickledOnion> yes good point - he does seem momentarily shocked [13:22] <MrMcGonagall> Everybody in the room was rather shocked. [13:22] <fawkes28> that is true, Mr. M [13:22] <JaneMarple9> he probably wasn't expecting umbridge to be so silly to interupt him! [13:23] <MrMcGonagall> It's one of those things... "This has never happened before. How do I respond?" [13:23] <Sophia40> I think he didn't want to make a scene in front of the students [13:23] <PrincessPickledOnion> i'd put money on a fight between toad and mcgonagall - no probz guessin who we'd all back ;) [13:23] <JaneMarple9> yes sophia [13:23] <JaneMarple9> errr our very own McGonagall smile [13:23] <PrincessPickledOnion> Maybe his stepping aside was overshadowing of the power she inherits later on [13:23] <PrincessPickledOnion> yes indeed biggrin [13:23] *** kittie69 has quit [Bye] [13:23] *** kittie69 has joined #lounge [13:24] <fawkes28> Was Umbridge appointed DADA teacher at Hogwarts before or after Harry’s hearing? Why? (Chamber 88) [13:24] *** kittie69 has quit [Bye] [13:24] <JaneMarple9> after i think [13:24] <PrincessPickledOnion> after. [13:24] <Sophia40> After I am sure [13:24] <MrMcGonagall> After, I think. Wasn't the educational decree that permitted Fudge to appoint her signed August 30? [13:24] <cbm> I think after as the law gave dd a chance to find a teacher [13:24] <JaneMarple9> because the book lists were sent out late [13:24] <fawkes28> after - i thought it was at the last possible minute because no one else would do it [13:24] <PrincessPickledOnion> it was like 28th of august the educational degree was passed [13:25] <cbm> the hearing was on the 12th [13:25] <JaneMarple9> they had to be sure which books the students needed [13:25] <PrincessPickledOnion> yep. not that the book is useful [13:25] <JaneMarple9> although dumbeldore probably knew that umbridge was going to take the job [13:25] <PrincessPickledOnion> excellent point [13:25] <PrincessPickledOnion> he reads fudge like a book [13:26] <MrMcGonagall> The appointment surely came after the hearing, but I wonder if Fudge didn't have something like this in mind all summer long. [13:26] <Sophia40> You poeple amase me with how you remember stuff kinda like Herminone lololololo [13:26] <JaneMarple9> yes princess - pretty useless book. even hermione didn't like it! [13:26] *** Hermeeownee has quit [Bye] [13:26] <fawkes28> Was the Toad not aware of the jinx upon the DADA position? What possessed it to take the job in the first place? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:26] <PrincessPickledOnion> an army i ask you *rolls eyes* [13:26] <cbm> I doubt she had a clue, as she is clueless about almost everything else [13:26] <JaneMarple9> fudge probably bribed her [13:26] <Sophia40> Political to the end [13:27] <PrincessPickledOnion> Probz didn't care about the DADA job - she had higher sights... like becoming headmistresses? Supreme toad of the Universe? [13:27] <PrincessPickledOnion> Joining a pink cardigan convention? [13:27] <MrMcGonagall> I don't think the Ministry has put two and two together about the position. They just see a high turnover. [13:27] <Aislinn> I bet she didn't believe in the jinx, even if she knew of it [13:27] <JaneMarple9> she may had been persuaded to go undercover - get her a even higher position in the Ministry [13:27] <Leeg> power hungry [13:27] <MrMcGonagall> I don't think DD has been bandying it about that LV jinxed the position, anyway. [13:28] <fawkes28> i think she was away from Fudge and wanted to throw her weight around at Hogwarts [13:28] <cbm> I bet she thought she could beat the jinx [13:28] <Sophia40> She is very Politically motivated [13:28] <JaneMarple9> yes she loved the power of being the DADA teacher [13:28] <PrincessPickledOnion> true if she doesn't believe in an evil moose like Voldie who's as solid as this wall *runs at it* she's hardely likely to believe in a jinx... good point Aislinn [13:28] <fawkes28> she definitely didn't fear Dumbledore and perhaps she thought she could rise to Headmistress [13:28] <JaneMarple9> oh i am she didn't know about the jink [13:28] <cbm> There are some people in the world, who put politics above the job, these folks can do incredible damage [13:28] <JaneMarple9> jinx* too [13:28] <MrMcGonagall> I also think Fudge and Umbridge only saw the position as an opportunity to get a foot in the door. Total Hogwarts domination was their real aim. [13:29] <PrincessPickledOnion> yes cbm [13:29] <JaneMarple9> and she probably thought she could beat it [13:29] <PrincessPickledOnion> I agree with MrMcG [13:29] <JaneMarple9> exactly Mr Mcg, the Ministry wanted to take over hogwarts [13:29] <MrMcGonagall> Getting Umbridge "inside" was phase one of the master plan. [13:29] *** cloudpic has joined #lounge [13:29] <fawkes28> oh, I think she also had plans to overthrow Fudge eventually [13:29] <JaneMarple9> and dislodge dumbledore [13:29] <MrMcGonagall> Trying to wrest control of the school from DD. [13:29] <fawkes28> hey cloudpic [13:29] <cbm> get rid of DD, just like in CoA, could this have really been a malfoy plot? [13:29] <Sophia40> Fudge has been trying to get a hold at Hogwarts for a while Umbridge is a good way to start [13:29] <MrMcGonagall> I don't think so, fawkes. [13:29] <PrincessPickledOnion> as soon as she was in, it didnt matter... fudge had insiders and they crack the whip - surrounding and smothering [13:30] <JaneMarple9> ((((Cloudpic))))) [13:30] <fawkes28> i think she wanted to be the minister - she is power hungry big time [13:30] * cloudpic waves to everyone... ah, wretched Umbridge, no doubt... [13:30] <JaneMarple9> she is a little like percy [13:30] <fawkes28> between her and Percy it will be a fight to the death laugh [13:30] <JaneMarple9> oh yes fawkes! [13:30] <PrincessPickledOnion> i think she wanted to marry fudge but that's just me *shivers convulsively at the horrid thought* [13:30] <cloudpic> Except Percy has a heart, however hard to find... [13:31] <Sophia40> rofl Fawkes [13:31] <JaneMarple9> they deserve each other! [13:31] <cbm> true she probably read "Prefect who gained power" also [13:31] <PrincessPickledOnion> hmmm i reserve judgement on percy [13:31] <JaneMarple9> i wonder if she went to hogwarts? [13:31] <cloudpic> He never showed signs that he enjoyed torturing anyone/anything [13:31] <PrincessPickledOnion> she did [13:31] <PrincessPickledOnion> she said it was lovely to be back [13:31] <JaneMarple9> which house would umbridge be in? [13:31] <fawkes28> In GoF, we learned the founders took Gryffindor’s hat and put brains into it to serve the purpose of sorting students into the Houses. This leads to Ron’s question: how does it know the school's in danger, if it's a hat? (Chamber 88/Room 18–The Atrium) [13:31] <cloudpic> the back pond [13:31] <JaneMarple9> beginning with a Ssssssss? biggrin [13:32] <Sophia40> OoooHgood question did she go to Hogwarts? [13:32] <PrincessPickledOnion> twisted idiot i didnt think they let toads in. MAYBE she was a gone-wrong engorgement charm! biggrin [13:32] <JaneMarple9> it is kept in dumbledores study [13:32] <cbm> great ?, I think there is still more to learn about the hat [13:32] <fawkes28> me too, cbm [13:32] <PrincessPickledOnion> yep [13:32] <cloudpic> hmmm.... the Hat has a bit more of a brain than I'm comfortable with... [13:32] <JaneMarple9> it must pick up all sort of things in dumbledores study [13:33] <cbm> I think it listened in on all of the conversations in the study [13:33] <fawkes28> it does have brains so even though it is an object, it is still intelligent [13:33] <Sophia40> I think it listens to what the headmasters are doing [13:33] <PrincessPickledOnion> Yes - mr weasley's point comes back.... where does it keep its brains? we can't see it [13:33] <fawkes28> and it hasn't ever been wrong about sorting people [13:33] <Aislinn> I think that it hears lots of important info in Dumbledore's office [13:33] <cloudpic> Yes, can you imagine that Hat discussing things with the other Headmaster/mistress's portraits? [13:33] <JaneMarple9> well jo has said it isn't a horcrux cloud smile But it does seem a very intelligent hat [13:33] <cbm> I think that It is like the paintings of the old headmasters [13:34] <MrMcGonagall> Maybe DD puts it on from time to time and it knows what's in his head. [13:34] <cloudpic> Arthur Weasley warned against objects which could think and you couldn't see where it stored its grain [13:34] <fawkes28> i wonder if it interacts with anyone else all year [13:34] <cloudpic> Oh, I like that, Mr.McG! [13:34] <PrincessPickledOnion> Yes Cloudpic - my point biggrin [13:34] <cbm> I think that applied more to unknown objects [13:34] <cloudpic> Wasn't the Hat what Fawkes brought to Harry in the Chamber? [13:34] <JaneMarple9> perhaps Mr McG, but I think dumbledore knows everything whats in his head [13:34] *** janieb has joined #lounge [13:34] <fawkes28> or if it just listens to what is going on in the headmaster's office - because then it would pick up a lot of information [13:34] <JaneMarple9> it was yes [13:34] <fawkes28> hi janieb [13:34] <Sophia40> Well we know it has other abilities than just sorting [13:34] <cbm> yes and somehow a sword came out of it [13:35] <MrMcGonagall> If I was Headmaster and had a hat that contained bits of the Founders' brains, I'd put it on and gain the benefit of that wisdom from time to time. [13:35] <cloudpic> Yes, but the Hat was "programmed" by all 4 Founders downloading their brains into it.... [13:35] <PrincessPickledOnion> Voila just like magic lol [13:35] <janieb> *peeking* Hi! [13:35] <JaneMarple9> i forget it brought the Gryffindor sword to harry [13:35] <cloudpic> and it seems to have developed its own opinions ideas about things since then [13:35] <cbm> I have always wondered if it was summoned or was stored there [13:35] <cloudpic> The sword in the Hat rather than stone [13:35] <PrincessPickledOnion> lol cloudpicbiggrin [13:35] <MrMcGonagall> We don't have portraits of the Founders (that we know of), so maybe the hat is portrait-substitute. [13:35] <fawkes28> What other sorts of warnings do you think the Sorting Hat has given, and did anyone heed them? (Chamber 88) [13:36] <cbm> The school is still there, so I assume so [13:36] <Aislinn> it sounds like the warnings are mainly to be united [13:36] <cloudpic> The school is still there... so it may have helped earlier [13:36] <cloudpic> LOL cbm [13:36] <MrMcGonagall> Hmm. Highly speculative questions, concerning whether anybody actually listened and acted on the warnings. [13:36] <fawkes28> i think it helps when it feels the need to [13:36] <Leeg> possibly warnings during the first opening of the chamber? [13:36] <fawkes28> perhaps in the days of Gindelwald [13:36] <JaneMarple9> it may have warned godric and salazar that they were going to fall out [13:36] <Sophia40> Nick said that it had in the past given similar advise [13:37] <cloudpic> I wonder if it said anything during Voldemort's first rise to power? [13:37] <Sophia40> To Stand together in time of difficulty [13:37] <JaneMarple9> i am sure he has mentioned violdie, during the sorting hat songs, over the years [13:37] <MrMcGonagall> I imagine most warnings have been about presenting a united front and overcoming differences among the houses. [13:37] <JaneMarple9> yes Mr McG [13:38] <cloudpic> Remember, that Hat sat on Tom Riddle's head.. [13:38] <cloudpic> too bad it didn't just say, Ewwwww [13:38] * MrMcGonagall pictures the Sorting Hat barfing on Tom Riddle. [13:38] <JaneMarple9> yes...what did the sorting hat say as it was on tom's head [13:38] <JaneMarple9> apart from "take me off him"!! [13:38] <fawkes28> What do you make of the fact that Slytherin and Gryffindor were once best friends? Does that change your perception of either founder? Is the hat biased towards Gryffindor; it was his after all? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:39] <Aislinn> slytherin, without hesitation, just like it did for Draco [13:39] <Sophia40> I think that it is predicting how the Houses will have to save Hogwarts With Draco gone the Slythrins will band with other houses [13:39] <cloudpic> No... they seem to be the two Houses which have strong opinions [13:39] <JaneMarple9> You think Aislinn? What makes you say that? biggrin [13:39] <Aislinn> we haven't seen any evidence of bias [13:39] <MrMcGonagall> I don't think the hat has a real bias. It has parts of all the founders' brains, after all. I think it does give us cause to reflect on the personality of Slytherin a bit more. [13:39] <fawkes28> this is one of my biggest pet theories - i do not think Slytherin was evil - i think his legend got so big and falsified [13:39] <cloudpic> No, it is a fair-minded Hat [13:39] <TheMadMuggle> me too [13:39] <JaneMarple9> it seems to favour gryffindors [13:40] <cloudpic> I agree, fawkes... not evil, but prejudiced just the same [13:40] <cbm> I do not think the hat is biased, the only bias we have seen is by a teacher [13:40] <TheMadMuggle> the fact that slytherin and gryffindor used to be friends shows he most likely wasn't completely evil [13:40] <JaneMarple9> but sorts all the students every year [13:40] <TheMadMuggle> they just had a difference of opinion on a matter [13:40] <fawkes28> it was over a thousand years ago and a lot has happened since then - it does show something that they were friends [13:40] <JaneMarple9> ye madmuggle, nice point [13:40] <JaneMarple9> the houses were united at some time [13:41] <TheMadMuggle> now the kinds of students that fit well into slytherin seem to be the kind of wizards that choose a different life path [13:41] <cbm> I agree madmuggle, I think that Voldemort has perverted slytherin for his own aims [13:41] <fawkes28> the only basis we have to compare Voldemort too is Slytherin so I think people's opinions of Slytherin get misconstrued [13:41] <TheMadMuggle> exactly [13:41] <MrMcGonagall> I find it interesting that the guys hung together and the women were best friends, too. [13:41] <TheMadMuggle> they don't consider there is a thousand year span between them [13:41] <cloudpic> But S. Slytherin did promote pure blood only students in his house... so his prejudice existed back when [13:42] *** Leeg has quit [Bye] [13:42] <fawkes28> but think about the times back then - witch and wizard hunting dominated [13:42] <Sophia40> But with the Guant Family we see that the Slythrins have some real twisted ideas [13:42] <fawkes28> he was trying to protect his people the best way he knew how to [13:42] <cbm> Slytherin did not want to teach them, Voldemort wants to kill them, quite a difference [13:42] <cloudpic> Yes, I agree [13:42] <fawkes28> and that is why i believe they disagreed [13:42] <PrincessPickledOnion> Its all about blood. Jumping to conclusions about the blood and assuming the attitude that they believe the blood allows and deems acceptable [13:42] <JaneMarple9> salazar did a few good points [13:42] <TheMadMuggle> exactly [13:42] <cloudpic> Quite a difference, cbm [13:42] <Aislinn> I think that the prejudice that he had, at the time he lived, may have had more basis in real fear of persecution [13:43] <JaneMarple9> (and I never thought i would say that about a slytherin!) [13:43] <fawkes28> Gryffindor was more trusting of muggles than Slytherin but Slytherin's legend has gotten misconstrued big time [13:43] <MrMcGonagall> One wonders what Slytherin would think of what his descendants have become. [13:43] <cloudpic> Yes, there was genuine persecution of apparent wizards and witches during those days [13:43] <fawkes28> yes, Aislinn [13:43] *** dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows has joined #lounge [13:43] <JaneMarple9> i don't think he would be overly proud of them Mr McGon [13:43] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> umm ok [13:43] <TheMadMuggle> of course salazar DID create the chamber with a monster to kill muggle borns [13:43] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> why did this come up? [13:43] <PrincessPickledOnion> The fact they used to be friends kind of holds hope for unity i s'pose. but i doubt we'll see unity simply because you can't please everyone [13:44] <fawkes28> this is the Corner Booth chat, Dylan [13:44] <cbm> Voldemort is not about blood, he is about power, he uses slytherin's ideas about blood to help him in route to that power [13:44] <MrMcGonagall> True, cbm. [13:44] <cloudpic> Yes, remember, Tom Riddle is not pure blood himself [13:44] <PrincessPickledOnion> i got to go for bit guys speak to you in a bit! xxxx [13:44] *** PrincessPickledOnion left #lounge [] [13:44] *** ltbrave23 has joined #lounge [13:44] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> hmm oh [13:44] <Sophia40> I think that S Slythrin fed his own legen with his prejudice [13:44] <cbm> Plus, that is what he told Harry in SS/PS [13:44] <TheMadMuggle> i expect to see some unity in DH from the slytherins [13:45] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> OH COOL I FINALLY FOUND A CHAT WHERE PEOPLE SPEAK ABOUT HARRY POTTER FOR ONCE [13:45] <Aislinn> no caps please, dylan [13:45] <fawkes28> What do you think was the reason for the end of their friendship? What were they fighting over? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:45] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> sorry [13:45] <cloudpic> Leaving behind his "Weapon of Mass Destruction" in the Chamber was perhaps intended to protect... [13:45] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> just alot of joy to finally be able to speak about Potter once more [13:45] <ltbrave23> i agree cloudpic [13:45] *** Leeg has joined #lounge [13:45] <cbm> I think it was a fight over princible and neither would yield [13:45] <Aislinn> It sounds like the difference in philosophy about the pure blood issue had a lot to do with it [13:46] <fawkes28> yes, cbm - i think they both are similar in that way [13:46] <MrMcGonagall> I agree, Aislinn. [13:46] <cloudpic> I'd always thought it had to do with which students could attend Hogwarts, but?? [13:46] *** padfoot27 has joined #lounge [13:46] <Sophia40> The pure bloods but not the Muggle borns Cloudpic [13:46] <cloudpic> Strong minded, both of them [13:46] <fawkes28> i also think that it was stressful times, which added to their situation [13:46] <TheMadMuggle> the blood issue is a pretty weighty issue, eventually the rift got too wide to repair [13:46] <ltbrave23> salazar thought he was protecting the wizarding race, and godric thought that he was hurting it. [13:46] *** padfoot27 has quit [Bye] [13:46] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> hmm so if someone would please be kind enough to tell me the topic that would be great [13:46] <MrMcGonagall> I think other differences may have come to the fore after the pureblood issue started the conflict. [13:46] <Aislinn> if they became so entrenched in their views, they may not have seen a way past it [13:46] <fawkes28> exactly, ltbrave [13:47] <Aislinn> we are talking about chapters from the Order of the phoenix, dylan [13:47] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> ah [13:47] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> thank you [13:47] <MrMcGonagall> We're discussing questions from Chapters 11 and 12. [13:47] <Aislinn> and there are questions posted by fawkes in bold [13:47] <cloudpic> Chapters 11 12 of Order of the Phoenix....currently discussing the friendship of Gryffindor and Syltherin [13:47] <ltbrave23> it was a fundamental difference in their beliefs, it's hard to reconcile the two [13:47] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> thank you that helps alot [13:47] <cloudpic> I wonder why Gryffindor was open-minded? [13:48] <Aislinn> about including muggles? [13:48] <cloudpic> Although he had his own bias in favor of bravery, evidently [13:48] <MrMcGonagall> I think GG perceived that it's not a good idea for those with magical talent to NOT be educated. [13:48] <Sophia40> Do you think that they will do away with sorting? [13:48] <cloudpic> Yes [13:48] <Aislinn> It sounded like he was more concerned with the bravery of the individual, than their blood line [13:48] <JaneMarple9> perhaps he was a half muggle himself? [13:48] <fawkes28> maybe he grew up differently than Slytherin [13:48] <cloudpic> That's a good point, Mr. McG. would seem safer [13:48] <Aislinn> that's a really good point, Mr M [13:48] <fawkes28> i am sure they had different experiences, which led them to their beliefs [13:48] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> good thinking JaneMarple9 [13:48] <cloudpic> In a kind of Weasley family, perhaps, fawkes [13:49] <Leeg> i agree Mr M, we've seen that you can do magic without knowing how, so it needs to be controlled through teaching [13:49] <MrMcGonagall> Look at the kind of havoc Tom Riddle was capable of causing before he even knew he was a wizard. [13:49] <fawkes28> Even though Slytherin was gone, the Houses never reunited as they were meant to do. Why not? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:49] <cbm> And maybe slytherin thought that showing non pure bloods put the school at risk [13:49] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> good point there, MrMcGonagall [13:49] <cloudpic> Even Harry's actions weren't all harmless when he didn't know what he was doing [13:50] <ltbrave23> it's also possible that godric saw a little further down the road. that allowing muggles in would actually preserve the wizarding world and not harm it. [13:50] <cloudpic> The activities and "House Points" seem to promote conflict [13:50] <JaneMarple9> because the chamber of secrets had been created? [13:50] <fawkes28> It is hard to lose someone you once considered a friend - it through off the balance of the four [13:50] <Aislinn> once they started heading down divergent paths, they probably continued to focus more on the differences than they did on similarities [13:50] <MrMcGonagall> I think it's because each house focuses on perfecting their own virtues rather than looking at the big picture. [13:50] <TheMadMuggle> very true cloud [13:50] <cbm> In order to unite the students, I think you 1st need to unite the heads of house [13:50] <Aislinn> Yes, cloudpic, they have competition and rivalry woven tightly into the culture of the school [13:50] <cloudpic> Even Minerva snarks at Severus [13:50] <JaneMarple9> it must have been hard, to have three heads of houses instead of four [13:50] <fawkes28> instead of turning to each other for comfort and unity, they all started focusing on their own thing [13:50] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> good point cbm [13:51] <Leeg> im just wondering why neither ravenclaw or hufflepuff appeared to have a much of say [13:51] <fawkes28> maybe they were afraid if staying close with each other - for fear of losing another friendship [13:51] <Aislinn> they may have had a say, leeg, but agreed with gryffindor [13:51] <JaneMarple9> they began to concentrate on their houses rather than uniting the whole school [13:51] <Aislinn> that could be another reason he left [13:51] <cbm> I think that 3 of the 4 heads could be united in OotP, and the other is a git smile [13:51] <cloudpic> The culture of the time wouldn't have favored listening to the women?? Leeg? [13:51] <Aislinn> LOL, cbm [13:51] * fawkes28 thinks cbm is baiting her [13:51] <JaneMarple9> smile [13:52] <Sophia40> Because the were women and back in those times women didn't stand up to men [13:52] * JaneMarple9 keeps her mouth tightly closed about a certain S, Sbaoe smile [13:52] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> lol sophia [13:52] <fawkes28> Do you think they will ever be reunited? How could this occur? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:52] <MrMcGonagall> I think losing one of the founders changed the dynamic of the relationship. [13:52] <Leeg> good point cloudpic [13:52] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> hmm they could be united one day [13:52] <JaneMarple9> they could be reunited [13:53] <cbm> I think they could be united in DH now that the git is gone smile [13:53] <TheMadMuggle> i wonder if it was the same between the sexes back then in the wizarding world [13:53] <Sophia40> No more sorting mix it up a bit [13:53] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> lol [13:53] <fawkes28> i think they have to be reunited in order for good to triumph over evil [13:53] <JaneMarple9> especailly if the new head of slytherin stays on [13:53] *** mollywobbles23 has joined #lounge [13:53] <Aislinn> I think if there is sufficient threat from without, it could change the focus to a united defense [13:53] <TheMadMuggle> a wand can be a great equalizer [13:53] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> you won't give up on Snape being a git will you, cbm? [13:53] <MrMcGonagall> I think everyone at the school needs to realize that there are things more important than Quidditch trophies and the House Cup. [13:53] <JaneMarple9> ((((Mollywobbles)))) [13:53] <Aislinn> I think it goes beyond that, though,Mr M [13:54] <mollywobbles23> Jane! [13:54] <fawkes28> someone will happen where hogwarts is attacked and everyone will find themselves on the same side to protect it [13:54] <JaneMarple9> like friendship! [13:54] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> yeah maybe if they were battling against the Death Eaters and Voldemort they might get something through their skulls about unity [13:54] <mollywobbles23> and chocolate [13:54] <TheMadMuggle> the blood issue is such an important part of the books and the reunification of Hogwarts has been mentioned enough times that it HAS to happen [13:54] <Aislinn> the slytherins have to be willing to change their views, and recognize the need to join forces with the other students [13:54] <JaneMarple9> oh Molly! A person after my own heart! [13:54] <MrMcGonagall> It goes back to re-capturing the original vision the founders had for the school. Why Hogwarts was founded in the first place. [13:54] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> Just because something is mentioned many times doesn't mean it has to happen, MadMuggle [13:54] <fawkes28> I think that perhaps the Sorting Hat will decide that the students should not be sorted this year [13:54] <cbm> I agree Aislinn, but the change needs to come from the top [13:54] <TheMadMuggle> i think it will happen symbolically as Draco turns his back on voldy [13:54] <JaneMarple9> like uniting against Voldemort too [13:55] <mollywobbles23> I'm a pusher of chocolate + a teacher, which much mean I = Lupin. hehe [13:55] <Aislinn> yes, that would certainly help,, cbm, but I don't know if it is essential [13:55] <Aislinn> Actually, it will be interesting to see what changes for the slytherins, with Draco gone [13:56] <fawkes28> all it takes is for one person to step up to change and then others can follow [13:56] <Sophia40> I think it won't sort them this year too [13:56] <cbm> I think it was impossible with previously with the way snape acted, I think he needed to be gone for any unity to occur. [13:56] <mollywobbles23> oh definitely. I'm guessing we're discussing the Sorting Hat song? [13:56] <mollywobbles23> right now, anyway? [13:56] <JaneMarple9> oh i think the sorting hat will sort as usual [13:56] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> well, I don't think Draco is what made all the Slytherins that way, Aislinn [13:56] <ltbrave23> well, it's not like draco was the only one who acted that way. he's just the main one we saw. [13:56] <JaneMarple9> and sing a extremely significant song [13:56] <janieb> Could Durmstrang and Beauxbatons students come into the mix? [13:56] <Aislinn> no, a lot of them shared his philosophy, dylan, but he was definitely a leader within his House [13:57] <fawkes28> Was the decision to split the school into houses a good or bad one? Or are the divisions between the students inherit to their own characters? Would the students themselves fall into their own groups according to their own preferences? (Room 18–The Atrium) [13:57] <ltbrave23> and the gryffindors are prejudiced against the slytherins just as much as the other way around. [13:57] <Sophia40> Well we do have Krum coming into DH [13:57] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> Maybe with Slughorn (assuming he is head of house and still teaching) as Head of Slytherin they will all change [13:58] *** Leeg has quit [Bye] [13:58] <Sophia40> He was head before and nothing change [13:58] <fawkes28> i think it is good to promote friendly rivalry but it has become not so friendly [13:58] <ltbrave23> i think the splitting could have been good, if it weren't for the dissension. [13:58] <mollywobbles23> yes, the students would fall into their own divisions. All students do that everywhere. Actually, all people do that. [13:58] *** Raldan has joined #lounge [13:58] <Aislinn> I think they fall into their groups according to the way that they've been raised, with a few exceptions, as well as with their individual temperaments [13:58] <Aislinn> It is human nature to seek out people with whom you share commonalities [13:58] <fawkes28> people are drawn to like-minded people - it is natural [13:59] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> Well, sorting the kids into groups is sort of bad actually. It's like what us kids do now about sorting kids into "clicks" and stuff. [13:59] <Raldan> Hi everyone. [13:59] <JaneMarple9> i think there will be four houses as usual in the final book [13:59] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> hey Raldan [13:59] <Aislinn> it can be bad, if taken to an extreme, dylan, you're right [13:59] <Sophia40> Look at all of us on a Saturday gathering [13:59] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> lol [13:59] <fawkes28> right when bully starts taking place, it has gone too far [14:00] <TheMadMuggle> like showing up to high school and having the administration show you which click you were going to be in for the next frou years [14:00] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> exactly [14:00] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> ooo yeah good point MadMuggle [14:00] <Aislinn> but administration doesn't do it for the students at Hogwarts - they sort themselves, in a way [14:00] <mollywobbles23> If it wasn't for the dissension, then I think that everyone would have probably at least one friend from each house. Look at the DA. [14:00] <ltbrave23> what's interesting themadmuggle, is that i think they would have naturally gone to these "groups" anyways. the hat just let them know about it. [14:00] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> yes that's true Aislinn [14:00] <cbm> I like that madmuggle [14:00] <fawkes28> even within the houses, there are groups or clicks [14:00] <TheMadMuggle> but the administration provides the means of sorting [14:01] <fawkes28> it is a natural progression of society [14:01] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> not really, fawkes [14:01] <Sophia40> I think that Neville if not sorted would have been a Hufflepuff [14:01] <TheMadMuggle> definitely [14:01] <mollywobbles23> not quite, Madmuggle, because the sorting hat reads your mind, and I bet many of the students end up choosing which house they get in, not just Harry. [14:01] <Aislinn> but the Hat looks within each student to find where to be sorted [14:01] <cbm> The DA showed that 3 of the 4 houses could unite [14:01] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> I mean, sure they like to hang out with a few people now and then, but they are all the same in a way [14:01] <JaneMarple9> awww smile No he's a gryffindor through and through neville [14:01] <ltbrave23> i don't think so Neville would have been a hufflepuff [14:01] <fawkes28> lavender doesn't really hang out with harry and company - they are part of different circles within their own house [14:01] <Aislinn> it is not an external decision, but one based on each student's temperament and personality [14:02] <ltbrave23> i meant i don't think he would have been a hufflepuff [14:02] <JaneMarple9> she hung out a little with ron smile [14:02] <MrMcGonagall> Well, I have to run. Have a great chat, everyone! [14:02] <Aislinn> neville showed bravery right from the first book [14:02] <cbm> true, lavender at this point thinks Harry is a liar [14:02] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> bye MrMcGonagall [14:02] <cbm> bye [14:02] <Aislinn> bye Mr M [14:02] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> nice meeting you [14:02] <Raldan> bye [14:02] <JaneMarple9> bye Mr McGon take care! [14:02] <Sophia40> bye [14:02] <janieb> bye [14:02] *** MrMcGonagall left #lounge [] [14:02] <ltbrave23> definitely aislinn, he's showed why he was sorted into gryffindor [14:02] <fawkes28> The division between the MoM and Hogwarts has been breached and the MoM is enforcing vision of education on the school. Has the MoM ceased to become a governmental function and lapsed into a dictatorship? (Chamber 007). [14:02] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> yes exactly Aislinn [14:03] <JaneMarple9> i think so [14:03] <cbm> I think so too [14:03] <mollywobbles23> it's on the verge here [14:03] <janieb> tooright [14:03] <JaneMarple9> i think the ministry is trying to tell dumbledore what to do [14:03] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> Yes quite a Nazi party the MoM has become [14:03] <JaneMarple9> and putting in umbridge as support too [14:03] <ltbrave23> it's more like there is a scared little man in charge who doesn't want his power taken [14:03] <JaneMarple9> they're trying to take over hogwarts! [14:03] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> The MoM is afraid of Dumbledore that's why they came in and tried to get the kids off magic [14:03] <Aislinn> it does seem to be attempting to exert control over everything in the wizarding world [14:03] <fawkes28> they aren't at the beginning of OotP but as the book progresses, i would say they have become a dictatorship [14:03] <ltbrave23> i wouldn't relate them to the nazi's dylan [14:04] <cbm> I think that at this point is it doing everything in it's power to help voldemort, even if it does not know it, and there is nothing to keep it from happening [14:04] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> yes that's true, ltbrave [14:04] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> I'd relate Death Eaters to them though [14:04] <Aislinn> a dictatorship is based on a single person - in this case, there is a scary group-think and denial going on [14:04] <ltbrave23> more communist then anything, making sure they had control of everything [14:04] <TheMadMuggle> yeah, Fudge pretty much made me sick throughout the whole book [14:04] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> I just tried to get the point of them being dictators [14:04] <mollywobbles23> I think we're confusing the entire ministry with Fudge and Umbridge. Dictatorship is a strong word. [14:04] <Sophia40> At this point MoM is under the Imperious Curse put on by Malfoy IMO [14:05] <JaneMarple9> hmmm interesting sophia [14:05] <Aislinn> you think the entire MoM is under an Imperius curse, sophia? [14:05] <cbm> I agree 100% Sophia [14:05] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> I don't see how Tonks and Shacklebolt can stand working for the MoM [14:05] <Aislinn> I think that they are making their choices freely, from their own positions of fear and prejudice [14:05] <Raldan> I wonder if umbridge is the stronger personality in the MoM or is Fudge? Who really calls the shots? [14:05] <JaneMarple9> not the whole ministry - but malfoy seems to pulling fudge's strrings [14:05] <cbm> I think in a manner of speaking, I think they are following the policies that Malfoy wants [14:05] <Aislinn> I don't think it is from Lucius at all [14:05] <mollywobbles23> at what point would that have happened, sophia? before or after Harry's trial? [14:05] <Sophia40> No mabe just Fudge who is in control [14:05] <JaneMarple9> malfoy senior that is [14:05] <ltbrave23> the MoM serves its purposes and is obviously necessary, otherwise DD wouldn't be trying to convince people within the ministry [14:06] <cbm> Malfoy Sr. had a year of seeing the mark get stronger, so I think he has been working on Fudge the whole time [14:06] <JaneMarple9> yews cbm [14:06] <Aislinn> I think fudge allows himself to be bought by Lucius, because he is comfortable being Minister, and doesn't want anything or anyone to interfere with that [14:06] <JaneMarple9> yes* not yews! [14:06] <Aislinn> I don't think that Lucius has him under mind control though [14:07] <TheMadMuggle> i don't hink he was under the imperius curse [14:07] <fawkes28> Hagrid seems to be considered a “joke” as a teacher by many students. Harry in particular is fiercely loyal to his giant friend. Is this because Hagrid brought him to the wizarding world or does Harry feel the need to befriend those who are perceived different, just as he was once deemed? (Chamber 007). [14:07] <TheMadMuggle> fudge seems to be weak enough to be controled by other means [14:07] <Aislinn> in some ways, it is much worse, as he is knowingly choosing to make the awful choices on his own [14:07] *** cloudpic has quit [Ping timeout] [14:07] <JaneMarple9> i think malfoy senior has been telling fudge what harry did at hogwarts myself [14:07] <mollywobbles23> I don't either. I think he would have been subtler had he been. Lucius may be evil, but he's not dumb. [14:07] <cbm> I think imperious is too strong of a word, but I think fudge is doing Malfoy's bidding [14:08] <janieb> fudge wants power at all costs [14:08] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> hmm this is a good question [14:08] <mollywobbles23> fiercely loyal [14:08] <ltbrave23> i think yall are giving Lucius a little to much credit [14:08] <Aislinn> politicians often are influenced by people of wealth and power [14:08] <Aislinn> I do too, ltbrave23 [14:08] <fawkes28> Harry honestly likes Hagrid [14:08] <TheMadMuggle> all mayfoy had to do was keep playing up dumbldedore and how much the wizarding world respects him [14:08] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> yes [14:08] <JaneMarple9> well hagrid is the first wizard harry ever met - apart from the time he was brought to privet drive [14:08] <Aislinn> I think that it is completely reasonable that Harry would be loyal to Hagrid, as Hagrid has been a wonderful friend to him, from the first moment he learned he was a wizard [14:09] <fawkes28> i don't think he tries to find people who are different, Harry is actually different himself - he is very unique so naturally he would be attracted to people who are too [14:09] <JaneMarple9> they seemed to make friends quickly - and hagrid seems CARING PERSON [14:09] <TheMadMuggle> well, hagrid was the first person that was really friendly to harry [14:09] <JaneMarple9> oopies biggrin [14:09] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> Mostly the Slytherins pick on Hagrid which most likely is not because he's a joke, but because he's a half breed [14:09] <fawkes28> yes, the Slytherins are not nice at all [14:09] <ltbrave23> i don't think Harry actually sees many people as different. he just sees people. the differences don't really matter. unless you're draco, of course. [14:09] <Aislinn> and they know how loyal he is to dumbledore, who they don't trust or believe in [14:10] <Raldan> Hagrid was the first wizard Harry felt liked him. He rescued him from the Dursleys. He was the first that made Harry feel he wasmore than a misfit. [14:10] <JaneMarple9> people try to tease hagrid [14:10] <Sophia40> Well we find the Ravenclaws have opinions about Hagrid [14:10] * mollywobbles23 sings "daylight come and me wanna go home" (Beetlejuice is on) [14:10] <cbm> lol [14:10] <JaneMarple9> yes hagrid is very loyal to dumbledore and harry [14:11] *** cbm has quit [Bye] [14:11] *** cbm has joined #lounge [14:11] <fawkes28> Why did Neville stand up for Harry? What prompted him to do this? (Room 62442–The Brain Room–NYBookworm). [14:11] <cbm> I had lag [14:11] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> Ok I must be off [14:11] <JaneMarple9> because neville always supports harry [14:11] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> I promise that I will come back tonight though [14:11] <Aislinn> bye Dylan [14:12] <JaneMarple9> and he doesn't people talking about their parents [14:12] <Raldan> bye [14:12] <Aislinn> we'll be back on tomorrow [14:12] <cbm> He and his grandmother can think for themselves [14:12] <dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows> Nice meeting you all [14:12] <janieb> bye [14:12] <cbm> bye [14:12] <fawkes28> they both understand each other [14:12] <JaneMarple9> take care dylan [14:12] <JaneMarple9> yes fawkes [14:12] <Aislinn> Neville honestly believes Harry, so it is natural that he would stand up for him [14:12] <fawkes28> Neville is a Gryffindor after all and looks out for Harry same way Harry does for him [14:12] <mollywobbles23> Partly because he believes Harry and partly because Harry has always stood up for Neville. [14:12] <JaneMarple9> they are very closely connected, harry and neville [14:12] <janieb> neville knows what it is to be misjudged [14:12] <ltbrave23> Harry treated Neville with a respect that not many others gave to him. [14:12] <Aislinn> good point, molly [14:12] <JaneMarple9> yes janieb [14:12] <Raldan> They both have lost their parents. He can relate to his loss. [14:13] <JaneMarple9> and yes molly [14:13] <JaneMarple9> and yes ralden! [14:13] <cbm> But it was also his grandmother who stood up for Harry [14:13] <Aislinn> yes she did [14:13] <Sophia40> I think that because of Neville experiences he feels a closeness to Harry [14:13] <ltbrave23> i think Neville would have stood up for Harry, even if his grandmother didn't [14:13] <TheMadMuggle> now if she'd only stand up for neville [14:13] <JaneMarple9> Mrs Longbottom senior also supports dumblefore [14:13] <Aislinn> the entire wizarding world has aligned themselves on either side of the argument, at this point in the story [14:13] <cbm> I think that she trusts DD [14:14] <JaneMarple9> i am sure she will in book 7 madmuggle [14:14] <ltbrave23> that's too true themadmuggle, but i think she thinks she is standing up for him in her own way [14:14] <fawkes28> Moving on to Chapter 12.... In this chapter, Ron and Hermione butt heads on everything from prefect duties to Snape’s character. What do you think of this, both in terms of their characterization and in terms of their relationship to Harry? (Chamber 29) [14:14] <TheMadMuggle> i sure hope so, and i really hope to see much more of neville in DH [14:14] <JaneMarple9> she thinks she's making him stronger [14:14] *** PrincessPickledOnion has joined #lounge [14:14] <mollywobbles23> Old married couple [14:14] <cbm> they are flirting smile [14:14] <PrincessPickledOnion> Hey everyone i'm back smile [14:14] <TheMadMuggle> :P [14:14] <fawkes28> ah, they fight like an old married couple definitely [14:14] <fawkes28> welcome back! [14:14] <Aislinn> I think that the bantering they do is the pattern of relationship they have developed over the years [14:15] <JaneMarple9> oh mad muggle - i want about 500 pages devoted to neville! [14:15] <Aislinn> It is comfortable for both of them [14:15] <ltbrave23> exactly jane, she saw what happened to his parents, and doesn't want it to happen to him [14:15] <Aislinn> wb PPO [14:15] <TheMadMuggle> i was SO disappointed in HBP for the lack of neville [14:15] <PrincessPickledOnion> thanks guys biggrin [14:15] <JaneMarple9> yes they do seem like molly and arthur [14:15] <TheMadMuggle> yeah they do [14:15] <PrincessPickledOnion> let me guess - ron n hermione? [14:15] <JaneMarple9> i hoping that is foreshadowing [14:15] <janieb> more like lucy and ricky! [14:15] <JaneMarple9> yep! [14:16] <cbm> Very try jane, even harry thinks so [14:16] <TheMadMuggle> would ron be lucy? [14:16] <Aislinn> yes PPO [14:16] <PrincessPickledOnion> i love hermione [14:16] <mollywobbles23> yes, actually [14:16] <mollywobbles23> Ron is Lucy! lol [14:16] <janieb> well, if the hair fits.. [14:16] <fawkes28> And what about the things they do agree on, like Harry taking his frustrations out on them and standing up to Umbridge? (Chamber 29) [14:16] <mollywobbles23> oh the mpreggers could have field day with that one [14:16] <PrincessPickledOnion> She's fab. she's so much like me - so i'm biased. [14:17] <fawkes28> i love when times get serious, Harry can always count of his friends [14:17] <Sophia40> It is important part of the growing up thing that Harry has to do as well as Ron Herminone This post has been edited by Aislinn: Apr 14 2007, 02:22 PM |
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Apr 14 2007, 02:11 PM
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Chief Cat Herder Posts: 3,514 Joined: 10:28am August 6, 2005 Location: In the Corner Booth - home of the elusive Holy Grain! |
[14:17] <mollywobbles23> old married couple, yet again. Argue about the little things, but agree on the big
[14:17] <JaneMarple9> yes fawkes [14:17] <TheMadMuggle> i'd love to be there for the practice speaches before they team up on harry [14:17] <PrincessPickledOnion> dictates the importance of their friendship... both agree - when harry's sure they wont [14:17] <JaneMarple9> they always support harry - even if they think it is reckless [14:17] <janieb> ditto here fawkes--and they really do care about each other under all that extra energy [14:17] <mollywobbles23> me too, madmuggle [14:17] <Aislinn> do we see ron agree with hermione about harry's reaction to umbridge? [14:17] <JaneMarple9> and they wouldn't do it themselves [14:17] <Aislinn> I don't recall that [14:17] <cbm> yes we do [14:18] *** dylan_andthe_deathly_hallows has quit [Ping timeout] [14:18] <cbm> Ron talked to Harry and I do not think he would have if he did not agree [14:18] <PrincessPickledOnion> they both agree that harry should stop jumping down their throats [14:18] <Aislinn> well, he told him to stop taking out his anger on the 2 of them [14:18] <Sophia40> They both agreed [14:18] <Aislinn> that is different from agreeing with her about his standing up to Umbridge [14:19] <PrincessPickledOnion> true [14:19] <fawkes28> Snape is always picking on Harry. Is it ever justified? What about this instance? [14:19] <cbm> I was talking only about taking his anger out on them for the agreement part [14:19] <TheMadMuggle> no [14:19] <JaneMarple9> it was in between [14:19] <PrincessPickledOnion> from day one. [14:20] <cbm> Snape had no justification in this instance as it is made clear that a number of people had worse potions [14:20] <Sophia40> No it had to start in the beginning [14:20] <TheMadMuggle> snape is an adult who is an authority figure, it is never alright to take personal frustrations out on a child [14:20] <JaneMarple9> harry really should had read the instructions better [14:20] <mollywobbles23> oh yeah, now I remember. I just read this part, that's sad. [14:20] <Aislinn> Snape is not justified in his abysmal treatment of harry or the other gryffindors [14:20] <Sophia40> to set the story [14:20] <cbm> But Jane, so should a number people [14:20] <JaneMarple9> but snape has hated harry from the time harry started [14:20] <Aislinn> right, cbm [14:20] <PrincessPickledOnion> totally agree with themadmuggle! [14:20] <mollywobbles23> Snape needs to mix a chill potion [14:20] <TheMadMuggle> hahaha [14:20] <PrincessPickledOnion> lol molly [14:21] <janieb> lol molly! [14:21] <JaneMarple9> i think, this is the only time, snape is justified for telling harry off [14:21] <cbm> It is made very clear that Harry was not even close to having the worst potion, snape is like normal way out of line here [14:21] <ltbrave23> it's not justified, but it's not as if Snape can be Harry's best friend either [14:21] <mollywobbles23> no, he wasn't justified [14:21] <fawkes28> now snape could be toughening Harry up for Voldemort smile [14:21] <Sophia40> Because of James treatment of Snape [14:21] <Aislinn> Goyle's potion was worse than Harry's, Jane, yet Harry was the only one Snape attacked [14:21] <TheMadMuggle> snape is a small petty man [14:21] * JaneMarple9 ignoring fawkes biggrin [14:21] <janieb> b/c of his love for Lilu [14:21] <Raldan> Is Snape playing a part at all, here? Even a little to show he hates the Potters. [14:21] <ltbrave23> could be fawkes....or at least i like to think so [14:22] <janieb> oops--LIly [14:22] <cbm> Not everydbody is toughened up by that treatment, see neville for an example [14:22] <PrincessPickledOnion> that's not an reason! that's a worming-excuse! [14:22] <JaneMarple9> ah but goyle's in slytherin [14:22] <Aislinn> so, he wasn't justifited, because he wasn't even handedin his treatment [14:22] <mollywobbles23> He should have told him what he did wrong, yes. But he shouldn't have evanescoed his entire potion away. If one of my students makes a mistake on assignment, I'm not going to tear up their paper and throw it away. I'll grade what they do have. [14:22] <TheMadMuggle> no, snape treated harry like crap long before he thought voldy was still around [14:22] <Sophia40> think Snape is good do you Fawkes? [14:22] <fawkes28> yes, but i didn't say Neville - I said Harry [14:22] <ltbrave23> it seems that Snape is calling for perfection from Harry, but not from the other students aislinn [14:22] <cbm> But snape did not correct any of the other students [14:22] <TheMadMuggle> snape may be working for the order, but he is not a good person [14:22] <Aislinn> exactly, ltbrave23 [14:22] <fawkes28> and Neville could have been the Chosen One so maybe that is why he gets picked on as well [14:22] <JaneMarple9> yes ltbrave [14:22] <Aislinn> and that is not justified [14:22] * mollywobbles23 has tons of things to grade this weekend and is dreading it [14:23] <JaneMarple9> and yes fawkes [14:23] <TheMadMuggle> grades....*shudders* [14:23] <PrincessPickledOnion> *PPO wishes she could help molly ... but recommends wine and chocolate [14:23] <Aislinn> Snape picks on Hermione as well, and she was not a potential Chosen One [14:23] <ltbrave23> it's not at all, but in the end i think it will help Harry in his fight against LV [14:23] <JaneMarple9> neville could had been harry is cirucumstances were changed [14:23] <Aislinn> snape just likes to be a total git and a bully [14:23] <mollywobbles23> got the chocolate [14:23] <cbm> Fawkes, his treatment of Harry and Neville has been consistent since day one, I think he just hates Harry and tis is how he shows it [14:23] <fawkes28> but Hermione is harry's friend and Snape knows she will go with him on his quest [14:23] <PrincessPickledOnion> i'd love hermione to get one over on snape.... [14:23] <janieb> here, here Aislinn [14:23] <TheMadMuggle> molly, what grade? [14:24] <JaneMarple9> oh yes PPO [14:24] <ltbrave23> i agree fawkes [14:24] <Aislinn> that has nothing to do with the classroom fawkes [14:24] <PrincessPickledOnion> Omg... give Aislinn a medal i totally agree biggrin [14:24] <Aislinn> and he doesn't tend to attack ron as much [14:24] <JaneMarple9> Hermione needs to show Snape how intelligent she is [14:24] <ltbrave23> i think it does aislinn, he's teaching them that there is no room for error [14:24] <fawkes28> because he doesn't think Ron has much potential maybe [14:24] <fawkes28> exactly, ltbrave [14:24] <Sophia40> I think that all the bad Slythrins have some muggle in them that hey resent how odd? [14:24] <ltbrave23> well, he knows that it is not Ron's forte, strategy is [14:25] <TheMadMuggle> i just wish snape could see that in many ways harry was him when he grew up [14:25] <mollywobbles23> 9th grade [14:25] <fawkes28> moving on..... We learn more about some of the side characters, particularly Seamus, Dean, Lavender and even Parvati. What were your thoughts about Seamus? Were you surprised he believed the Prophet? Why or why not? (Chamber 29, Room 18–The Atrium) [14:25] <PrincessPickledOnion> yerp Jane - i reckon it'd be 'poetic justice' the only person i can think of who'd do it well is neville... biggrin [14:25] <mollywobbles23> some 10th [14:25] <TheMadMuggle> <-- 2nd [14:25] <Aislinn> so, in other words, he is a bully and a git, for his own, irrational belief system [14:25] <mollywobbles23> and a theater class [14:25] <cbm> so not matter what, he is a bully and a git [14:25] <janieb> I don't htink seamus really believed the prophet [14:25] <JaneMarple9> well the Prophet writes it very cleverly [14:26] <mollywobbles23> no, I'm not surprised. I was angry, though. He knows Harry, so he should know better. [14:26] <cbm> I think he believed it, but now he is seeing the 2 sides up close [14:26] <TheMadMuggle> but i don't think seamus and harry were really CLOSE [14:26] <JaneMarple9> they hide their accruations between waffle (waffle = rubbish) [14:26] <fawkes28> Many people believe in the news and don't have any reason to doubt it [14:26] <Sophia40> No I think that Seamus wanted to believe Harry but it is hard to go against your parents [14:26] <Aislinn> I think that it is common for kids to spout the beliefs of their parents, and tha is what seamus is doing here [14:26] <TheMadMuggle> i mean, they didn't seem to hang out a lot [14:26] <mollywobbles23> good point, Aislinn [14:26] <JaneMarple9> but seamus was put into gryffindor [14:27] <janieb> he wanted a reason to change his mind [14:27] <PrincessPickledOnion> Very true Aislinn [14:27] <fawkes28> people here things from their parents and tend to believe them [14:27] <JaneMarple9> so he must have some good points [14:27] <JaneMarple9> yes fawkes [14:27] <Sophia40> I think the that he wants to here the whole story, the truth [14:27] <Raldan> Seamus has never experienced the kind of character assasination tat Harry has, so he may not believe there could be such a reaction to one fellow student, without some reason. He does seem to keep his own opinion. [14:27] <Aislinn> it doesn't make him a bad person, jane, just one who is not ready to really examine the facts logically [14:27] <cbm> Being in the house does not make him good, just brave [14:28] <janieb> if harry had been able to express the truth at that moment--they would have understood each other [14:28] <cbm> I also do not think he is bad, just misinformed [14:28] <fawkes28> Lavender thinks Harry is a nutter. Hermione told her to keep her fat mouth shut about Harry. Were you surprised by this? Why or why not? What does this say about Lavender? (Chamber 29, Room 18–The Atrium) [14:28] <TheMadMuggle> exactly [14:28] <mollywobbles23> no, not surprised at all [14:29] <Aislinn> that she, like seamus, prefers to go along with popular opinion [14:29] <janieb> lavender has never struck me as a particualrly discerning person [14:29] <JaneMarple9> well lavendar thinks trelawnly is wonderful smile [14:29] <mollywobbles23> Lavender seems to be very much about going along with what the crowd thinks/says [14:29] <Aislinn> too right, janieb [14:29] <PrincessPickledOnion> maybe its a bit like CHo - she's confused about her feelings for harry considering she was ced's gf and harry was found clutching his dead body; Maybe seamus feels confused because he know's harry and gets on with him and then has to listen and put up with his mother's badgering. Maybe he felt he had no choice to accept the prophets view otherwise he wouldn't be returning to hogwarts [14:29] <JaneMarple9> so she is bound to think the prophet is right [14:29] <Aislinn> that's possible, PPO [14:29] <Sophia40> Believes what she hears and reads [14:29] <cbm> I have never thought lavender was that sharp [14:29] <JaneMarple9> yes sophia [14:29] <ltbrave23> i agree cbm [14:29] <PrincessPickledOnion> No! Go hermione is all i have to say. [14:30] <JaneMarple9> no she's not all that bright really [14:30] <Aislinn> he left school right after it happened, and had his mother(same with Lavender) expressing a very different view all summer long [14:30] <PrincessPickledOnion> Parvati and lavender are the gossips. they're the Bertha Jorkins of hogwarts currently [14:30] <JaneMarple9> just a background character until book 6 [14:30] <TheMadMuggle> after won-won, i'll never think the same way about lavender again [14:30] <mollywobbles23> lol [14:30] <cbm> lol [14:30] <JaneMarple9> lav lav and ron ron [14:30] <PrincessPickledOnion> see! She's can't spell either lol [14:31] <TheMadMuggle> haha [14:31] <fawkes28> Parvati incredulously questioned the lack of practical preparation for the practical portion of the OWLs. Did this give you any further insight into Parvati? (Chamber 29, Room 18–The Atrium) [14:31] <cbm> I wonder if won-won remembered how lavender felt about harry [14:31] <JaneMarple9> :) nor can I appently! [14:31] <Sophia40> I know madmug she did about face didn't she [14:31] <cbm> It raised my opinion of her [14:31] <Aislinn> Her twin is in Ravenclaw, so it didn't surprise me that she would be the one to question this fact [14:31] <janieb> grades matter to her--but a least she was willing to voice her opinion [14:31] <JaneMarple9> we don't know much about the patil twins [14:31] <Aislinn> She probably has some of that high achievement tendency as well [14:32] <mollywobbles23> yeah, it's a very logical question. she wouldn't have asked had Hermione not started it all, though. [14:32] <cbm> It maid me think that she is more like her sister and maybe she nearly also was placed in ravenclaw [14:32] <JaneMarple9> except that parvatti's sister is now a prefect [14:32] <cbm> made [14:32] <mollywobbles23> probably so, Aislinn, her twin is a Ravenclaw and a prefect. [14:32] <JaneMarple9> she may have aimmed to be a prefect too - and planned to study hard [14:32] <cbm> but she was going against hermione, so there is probably no way she could have been a prefect [14:32] <TheMadMuggle> maybe her twin wouldn't have voiced her opinion, which is why she wasn't suited for gryffindor [14:32] <PrincessPickledOnion> very true - yet again miss granger is the provokation [14:33] <mollywobbles23> good point, MadMuggle [14:33] <Sophia40> But the bravery to ask the question up is Gryffindor [14:33] <cbm> I like that madmuggle [14:33] <janieb> Hermy stands for truth again! [14:33] <PrincessPickledOnion> hear hear [14:33] <Raldan> Its interesting how few voice any opinion, and are willing to accept this wierd approach. [14:33] <TheMadMuggle> or maybe when she put the hat on she said 'for the love of god let me two minutes peace from my identical twin!' [14:33] <fawkes28> The Gryffindors definitely stood up to the Toad. Do you any other House questioned her course aims? If so, which one(s)? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:34] <JaneMarple9> smile [14:34] <Aislinn> lol TheMadMuggle [14:34] <JaneMarple9> the slytherins probably wouldn't [14:34] <PrincessPickledOnion> hell no [14:34] <cbm> I bet the Ravenclaws did, just more calmly than Harry [14:34] <mollywobbles23> Slytherin probably did at first, but then they realized they should suck up instead. [14:34] <Aislinn> I bet the Ravenclaws did too [14:34] <JaneMarple9> because they saw umbridge as a yeacher they could get on their side [14:34] <PrincessPickledOnion> i kno lee did which was funny [14:34] <mollywobbles23> Ravenclaws probably did and I bet Ernie was the Hermione for the Hufflepuffs [14:34] <Aislinn> high grades, and learning all they could, would be very important to them [14:35] <fawkes28> right the Gryffindors are very brave - i am sure the other houses do so in their own ways [14:35] <mollywobbles23> wait, is Ernie a Hufflepuff? [14:35] <TheMadMuggle> i bet the puffs seriously considered writing a politely worded letter [14:35] <JaneMarple9> hufflepuffs and ravenclaws probably stood up to her [14:35] <Aislinn> and we see some of them later in the DA, so they obviously weren't happy with her course aims [14:35] <janieb> interesting queston... [14:35] <PrincessPickledOnion> yes molly he is [14:35] <janieb> do the Gryffindors share DADA with anyone this year? [14:35] <Raldan> slytherins were probably getting al the practical training they needed harassing fellow students in the hals. [14:35] <mollywobbles23> k, brain fart [14:35] <JaneMarple9> but not as much as harry did [14:35] <Aislinn> I don't think they ever share DADA, janieb [14:35] <JaneMarple9> i don't think dada is shared...is it? [14:36] <cbm> not that I remember [14:36] <JaneMarple9> biggrin sometimes there is a great echo in the booth! [14:36] <PrincessPickledOnion> neither is charms trans [14:36] <janieb> oops--didn't remember that--thanks, Aislinn [14:36] <Sophia40> In the movies they share hhahahahaha [14:36] <fawkes28> Do you agree with McGonagall's assessment of the situation–should Harry “keep his head down?” Why would McGonagall give Harry this kind of advice? (Chamber 88) [14:36] <PrincessPickledOnion> dont get me started on the movies ggrrr [14:36] <JaneMarple9> ah thats the movies! [14:37] <janieb> can I have a ginger newt/ [14:37] <JaneMarple9> because she wants him to keep his head down [14:37] <PrincessPickledOnion> yes. She knows more than him [14:37] <fawkes28> yes and no - because Harry has a hard time controlling his feelings and i think he had every right to stand up to umbridge [14:37] <mollywobbles23> she probably suspects that the Ministry has it out for Harry [14:37] <PrincessPickledOnion> her and fudge want more reasons to discredit him and DD [14:37] <JaneMarple9> not to let anything drop about the order [14:37] <Aislinn> I think that she recognizes that the best way to function in the current climate is to fly under the radar [14:37] <cbm> I think her advise is part of the problem for what comes later, he will keep his head down and not complain about the quill [14:37] <janieb> she's teaching him to "pick his battles" [14:37] <PrincessPickledOnion> excellent point Aislinn [14:37] <TheMadMuggle> there is a lot more going on here than creating more problems with the ministry spy [14:37] <JaneMarple9> don't cross umbridge - she can think of evil punishments [14:37] <fawkes28> but i think it was an important battle to pick [14:38] <TheMadMuggle> i'm sure she can see battles on the horizon and harry just needed to pick his battes better [14:38] <Aislinn> it is practical advice, born of an understanding of the amount of influence that Umbridge held within the power structure of the Ministry [14:38] <janieb> great point, fawkes [14:38] <Raldan> McG knows that the MoM has it out for Harry and would love to make an object of him. [14:38] <fawkes28> however, he learned a hard lesson because of it - but it is unlike Harry's character to stay quiet [14:38] <JaneMarple9> she is saying that the voldemort battle is more important than umbridge? [14:38] <Aislinn> totally unlike his character, yes [14:38] <PrincessPickledOnion> he rebels using the DA though [14:39] <Aislinn> I think so, jane [14:39] <PrincessPickledOnion> that's his outlet to vent his feelings [14:39] <JaneMarple9> McGon doesn't want harry to have another ministry hearing [14:39] <cbm> But the DA is behind the scenes, he does not confront her openly [14:39] <JaneMarple9> because the next one would probably expel him [14:39] <Aislinn> and that is more what McG is advocating, imo, cbm [14:40] <Raldan> Aso have another opportunity for DD to have to confront Harry unnecessarily. [14:40] <ltbrave23> well, and by keeping his head down he deprives Umbridge of exactly what she wants [14:40] <janieb> she realizes how precarious his situation is right now [14:40] <JaneMarple9> she wants harry to do the barest minimum in umbridges lessons and keep his mouth shut [14:40] <PrincessPickledOnion> doesn't need to = satisfaction of undermining and progressing abillities without the ministry is empowering [14:40] <Aislinn> yes, ltbrave23 - she was thrilled when she was able to make an object of Harry [14:40] <Aislinn> to drive the Ministry's POV home to the rest of the students [14:40] <JaneMarple9> after all - he only has to read a pointless book! smile [14:40] <fawkes28> Did Umbridge expect Harry to lose his cool and thus exhibit more “unstable” behavior as a method to further discredit him? If so, did Harry fall right into this trap? Could he have avoided this altogether? (Chamber 007). [14:41] <ltbrave23> exactly aislinn [14:41] <ltbrave23> i think she was purposely trying to rile him [14:41] <Aislinn> yes, as stated above smile [14:41] <PrincessPickledOnion> ummm one word.... YES [14:41] *** MirandaV has joined #lounge [14:41] <JaneMarple9> harry could have tried harder, to ignore umbridge [14:41] <Aislinn> hi miranda [14:41] <fawkes28> well, she stays very calm while he is yelling and hollering - so from the outside - who is the one who looks crazy? Harry [14:41] <PrincessPickledOnion> No because his anger is too prominent [14:41] <cbm> I think so I think she actually believed everything that was written and said about him [14:41] <janieb> i think she wants brainwash everybody more than anything [14:41] <ltbrave23> i think harry danced around the trap but never really falls too far in [14:41] <Raldan> An unavoidable trap for Harry [14:41] <MirandaV> I made it, barely! hi all [14:41] <Sophia40> I think that that is the focus of Umbridge is to discredit Harry and DD [14:41] <JaneMarple9> do a hermione and concentrate on the book! [14:41] <TheMadMuggle> i think she just wanted to punish him for his success at the hearing [14:42] <JaneMarple9> but harry is full of emotion [14:42] <Aislinn> yes, I think that is one of her primary goals, sophia [14:42] <JaneMarple9> perhaps madmuggle, nice point [14:42] <MirandaV> Are we talking about Umbridge? [14:42] <ltbrave23> yep [14:42] <Aislinn> yes we are [14:42] <JaneMarple9> either her or a toad [14:42] <mollywobbles23> I don' t think she expected it, but she did use the opportunity to her advantage. [14:42] <cbm> I do not think she thought she was brainwashing, I think she thought she was promoting the truth [14:42] <fawkes28> oh, yes - i bet she is still annoyed beyond anything that harry survived the dementors [14:42] <JaneMarple9> take your pick smile [14:42] <janieb> si [14:42] <Aislinn> i agree, cbm [14:42] <MirandaV> lol Jane...definitely a poisonous toad [14:43] <Aislinn> she chose to believe the lies that fudge and the prophecy were spewing [14:43] <janieb> cbm--she honestly doubts harry? [14:43] <JaneMarple9> and yes fawkes totally agreed [14:43] <ltbrave23> yes fawkes, it really showed her loyalty to the ministry though. doing anything to protect the one in power [14:43] <MirandaV> I'm not sure she still believed him...I think she had her own agenda [14:43] <cbm> Yes, because she believes Fudge [14:43] <PrincessPickledOnion> she's in love with fudge [14:43] <Aislinn> I think that she truly believes the drivel that she spouts [14:43] <Sophia40> She is just a pawn on the chess board of the MoM [14:43] <Raldan> She is one vindictive toad! [14:44] <PrincessPickledOnion> she wants to make Fudge-Chocolate Toad Babies [14:44] <ltbrave23> i just think, like Peter, she is loyal to the one in power, if not Fudge someone else [14:44] <janieb> thanks you all--i never considered that [14:44] <fawkes28> she stops at nothing - i bet she was thrilled at the opportunity to teach him all year to make his life horrible [14:44] <MirandaV> Oh, I agree there Aislinn, but I think it was because she had an agenda...just one more power hungry person in the MoM [14:44] <JaneMarple9> smile only somebody desparate for power could love fudge PPO! [14:44] <ltbrave23> i hope not ppo!!!! [14:44] <cbm> I think that Fudge could have told her the world is flat and she would have believed it [14:44] <PrincessPickledOnion> She does... she's sick. [14:44] <TheMadMuggle> haha [14:44] <ltbrave23> probably cbm [14:44] <Aislinn> definitely power hungry, miranda [14:44] <Raldan> Shes sinister [14:44] <TheMadMuggle> i just can't get over how she's not in azkaban [14:44] <JaneMarple9> shes evil! [14:44] <janieb> i guess i gave her too much credit [14:45] <Raldan> No soul to lose! [14:45] <cbm> She was willing to send dementors after Harry, I would call that attempted murder, all of that was for fudge [14:45] <JaneMarple9> better off in st mungos, mad muggle [14:45] <TheMadMuggle> haha, good point [14:45] <PrincessPickledOnion> I have no hesitation in expressing that she's the type of woman to marry the boss, kill him subtley and then resume control. [14:45] <MirandaV> yeah, not only powe hungry, but siriusly evil in her thinking also. She has no qualms about hurting people to get what she wants [14:45] <Aislinn> Only 15 minutes left, everyone! This has been a great chat! I want to remind you all that this transcript can be found at the Corner Booth Forum http://www.leakylounge.com/Corner-Booth-f184.html. [14:45] <JaneMarple9> and where is she now? smile [14:45] <fawkes28> Trelawney gives the students the task of writing a Dream Oracle. Why is Harry so keen to keep his dreams to himself? (Chamber 007). [14:45] <ltbrave23> well, she was on ministry orders, for the most part, you would have to put the one who gave the orders in azkaban to [14:45] <cbm> still at the ministry [14:45] <ltbrave23> aside from the dementor attack of course [14:45] <PrincessPickledOnion> dreams are private [14:45] <JaneMarple9> because he doesn't understand them [14:45] <Sophia40> How will JKR get her in DH I can't wait [14:46] <janieb> at this point because he is still grieving Cedric and want to keep that private [14:46] <JaneMarple9> he keeps dreaming of ceds death [14:46] <mollywobbles23> his dreams are pretty horrible and/or confusing [14:46] <Aislinn> Harry is not one to show vulnerability, and a lot of his dreams are nightmares of Voldy, or show his feelings for Cho [14:46] <ltbrave23> he doesn't want anyone to think he is crazier then they already do. that he can't take care of himself [14:46] <MirandaV> Dreams are private and his are emotional too, and that is private [14:46] <TheMadMuggle> well, she also almost performed an unforgivable curse on a student [14:46] <Raldan> He must feel a little guilty in exploring the deams that DD has told him to avoid [14:46] <PrincessPickledOnion> she's already trying to read his mail - imagine finidng his diary and handing that in! St. Mungo's would have a field day!! :o [14:46] <Sophia40> Because they are all about LV [14:46] <JaneMarple9> not something you want to broadcast - i see "dead horses" and dream of dead people!! [14:46] <TheMadMuggle> haha [14:46] <MirandaV> I see dead people...wooooooooooohaa [14:47] <PrincessPickledOnion> i see marshmellows [14:47] <fawkes28> it is better for people not to know Harry's dreams - they may think he is even more crazy than they already do [14:47] <janieb> harry could stat in The Seventh Sense" [14:47] <fawkes28> i would never share mine with Trelawney [14:47] <MirandaV> I agree fawkes [14:47] <PrincessPickledOnion> hear hear fawkes [14:47] <ltbrave23> i also don't think that he thought anyone would have thought the dreams to be significant, at least in the beginning [14:47] <MirandaV> No way, she'd announce them to the class for one thing [14:47] <JaneMarple9> well 7 comes up a lot in Harry Potter Janie smile [14:47] <fawkes28> What did you think of Cho again trying to talk to Harry? And of Ron running her off by challenging her about her choice of Quidditch teams? (Room 62442–The Brain Room) [14:47] <janieb> he he Jane [14:48] <cbm> I wonder how many of the students did share their true dreams [14:48] <PrincessPickledOnion> Typical. [14:48] <JaneMarple9> nor me fawkes - dreams are strictly private [14:48] <TheMadMuggle> ron's an idiot? [14:48] <MirandaV> Well, I don't like Cho much...so I wasn't really upset [14:48] <fawkes28> i love Ron - he is so clueless [14:48] <cbm> Ron was clueless and cho is interested in Harry [14:48] <PrincessPickledOnion> I loved the fact that my frustration at that point would be exactly how hermione would have felt. Loved it. [14:48] <Aislinn> Ron was such an insensitive boy in that scene [14:48] <JaneMarple9> well lav lav and parvati would have shared the dreams [14:48] <TheMadMuggle> i love ron too, but he's so hopeless [14:48] <Raldan> Ron was not obn the same page as Harry, maybe not the same book! [14:48] <Aislinn> lol, raldan [14:48] <fawkes28> no awareness at all that boy - it is very humorous [14:49] <MirandaV> But Ron is a little clueless at that part...I don't think he meant to be insensitive, but yes, he was [14:49] <Sophia40> I think that she really understands her feelings and uses Harry [14:49] <TheMadMuggle> hermione has her work cut out for her [14:49] <JaneMarple9> it was a bit insentive of ron with cho's badge [14:49] <janieb> I think she does want help to understnd Ced's death--in the end there was just too much working against them (but Ron sure didn't help!) [14:49] <fawkes28> lol MM [14:49] <Aislinn> right - it is cluelessness that leads to the insensitivity [14:49] <mollywobbles23> Yeah, Ron was clueless. [14:49] <janieb> deifnitely MM! [14:49] <Sophia40> OOOps doesn't understand her feelings I mean [14:49] <ltbrave23> i really just don't like Cho, so i appreciated Ron's interference [14:49] <MirandaV> I think she only wanted a shoulder to cry on honestly...it was really all about Cedric and doomed from the start [14:49] <JaneMarple9> its only a badge after all - is quidditch that important???? [14:49] <MirandaV> I don't like her either lt [14:49] <JaneMarple9> Cho is annoying! [14:49] <mollywobbles23> He's a boy: he couldn't have read Harry's mind about feelings. [14:49] <cbm> it is only 9 months after the ball and ron has shown no growth at all [14:50] <Aislinn> not at this point, no [14:50] <janieb> I am so annoyed iwht ron right now [14:50] <MirandaV> he grows later on [14:50] <JaneMarple9> i think he begins to change after christmas, after the snake attack [14:50] <MirandaV> I agree Sophia [14:51] <MirandaV> Yes, Jane, it brings some things home to him [14:51] <Sophia40> Rons gets it in the end [14:51] <cbm> I agree Jane [14:51] <mollywobbles23> me too, Jane [14:51] <janieb> is there any reason to have sympathy with the way he's acting in these chapters? [14:51] *** fawkes28 has quit [Bye] [14:51] *** fawkes28 has joined #lounge [14:51] <Sophia40> I feel sorry for at this point [14:52] <JaneMarple9> nope! [14:52] <cbm> I do not feel sorry for ron at all [14:52] <Raldan> Its what I love about Ron, he's such a bonehead sometimes [14:52] <fawkes28> Ron and Harry play Hangman during Binn’s class. What’s the significance of that? (Room 62442–The Brain Room) [14:52] <JaneMarple9> ron's being a insentitive git! [14:52] <JaneMarple9> interesting! [14:52] <JaneMarple9> more foreshadowing?? [14:52] <Aislinn> there are so many references to hanged man - I think it must have some significance [14:52] <PrincessPickledOnion> very interesting [14:52] <cbm> I don't see any at all, but I am probably wrong [14:52] <mollywobbles23> no idea [14:52] <MirandaV> Good question...unfortunately I don't have a good answer [14:52] <MirandaV> "D [14:52] <fawkes28> i love how Jo gave us the title this way and how she makes references to the hanged man in her books [14:52] <MirandaV> :D [14:52] <janieb> Boys! [14:53] <fawkes28> yes, i don't think it was a random idea of hers [14:53] <JaneMarple9> i am sure it connects with book 7! [14:53] <MirandaV> Well, the hanged man doesn't have to hang....so maybe it's about chances [14:53] <MirandaV> You have to get it right to save a life [14:53] <PrincessPickledOnion> good idea miranda [14:53] <JaneMarple9> trelawnly had the hanged man tarot card in book 6 [14:53] <PrincessPickledOnion> ohh yeh well pointed out jane!! [14:53] <fawkes28> nice point, miranda [14:53] <JaneMarple9> and in book 4 we had little hangleton and the hanged man pub [14:53] <PrincessPickledOnion> *smacks head in hand [14:53] <Sophia40> good one MirandaV [14:54] <fawkes28> yes, we do, Jane [14:54] <JaneMarple9> deathly hallows scattered all over the book! [14:54] <PrincessPickledOnion> omg. there's more connections!!!!!!!! [14:54] <ltbrave23> kind of like the potion logic in SS, if you got it right you survived, if wrong you died [14:54] <janieb> wow--you all are good! [14:54] <TheMadMuggle> no kidding [14:54] <Raldan> Hmmm, [14:54] <fawkes28> Fred and George put up an ad for “simple, part-time, virtually painless work.” They also warned that “all work is undertaken at the applicant’s own risk.” What did you think of this ad? What did you think of their ad? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:54] <JaneMarple9> funny biggrin [14:54] <mollywobbles23> lol [14:54] <MirandaV> At least they were honest!! laugh [14:54] <cbm> good for a laugh [14:54] <Aislinn> I thought it was hysterical, and so typical of the twins [14:54] <JaneMarple9> typical fred and george [14:55] <fawkes28> well, they are good businessmen [14:55] <TheMadMuggle> very true [14:55] <JaneMarple9> comic relief [14:55] <janieb> this is where they step over the line of false advertising [14:55] <ltbrave23> i was like painless, yeah, ok, but i thought it was hilarious [14:55] <PrincessPickledOnion> funny [14:55] <JaneMarple9> they wanted to taunt ron and hermione too [14:55] <Sophia40> You all a maze there should be game show [14:55] <Raldan> Uniquely Gred and Forge [14:55] <fawkes28> it definitely reflects their personality [14:55] <mollywobbles23> no, not false advertising, just doublespeak [14:55] <JaneMarple9> see if they would start the prefect thing on them [14:55] <ltbrave23> they are not exactly false advertising though janieb, they actually got around false advertisement with the use of the word virtually, they know how to leave loopholes [14:55] <MirandaV> Yeah, after all they said virtually not totally painless... biggrin [14:55] <JaneMarple9> see if ron had the guts to dock points from them [14:56] <JaneMarple9> they could make good lawyers if they didn't have the joke shop!! [14:56] <Raldan> They did some experiments on themselves though [14:56] <cbm> but there are 4 other prefects they had to worry about, so I think they just did it [14:56] <Sophia40> two heads are better than one Hhahahaha [14:56] <fawkes28> Last question.... Who would be dopey enough to volunteer to work for Fred and George? (Room 18–The Atrium) [14:56] *** cloudpic has joined #lounge [14:56] <PrincessPickledOnion> or no heads thanks to their hats! laugh [14:56] <ltbrave23> i agree jane and raldan, anything they were going to do to other people, they had already done to themself [14:56] <TheMadMuggle> first years [14:56] <JaneMarple9> ermmm Neville? [14:56] <Raldan> I got the ipression that they saved the more dangerous for themselves [14:57] <mollywobbles23> first years, apparently [14:57] <MirandaV> Aparently, first years mostly! [14:57] <cbm> the creveys [14:57] <janieb> I bow to their subtle cleverness--but first years, pu-leeze! [14:57] <Aislinn> apparently a number of ickle firsties biggrin [14:57] <fawkes28> oh, yes definitely first years [14:57] <PrincessPickledOnion> lol aislinn! [14:57] <fawkes28> and maybe some admirers of F & G [14:57] <JaneMarple9> I can see poot neville being gulliable enough [14:57] <PrincessPickledOnion> yes [14:57] <MirandaV> Yeah, they always tested on themselves first, so there wasn't a whole lot of danger for those who volunteered [14:57] <PrincessPickledOnion> he took a canary cream [14:57] <fawkes28> i could see Romilda possibly doing it [14:57] <JaneMarple9> just to show the others that they were perfectly harmles.....Not biggrin [14:57] <MirandaV> Only if Harry was fawkes... biggrin [14:57] <PrincessPickledOnion> ohhh i hope she did [14:57] <Aislinn> right, miranda [14:57] <Sophia40> naaaa Neville been through enough [14:58] *** cloudpic has quit [Bye] [14:58] <JaneMarple9> all the first years [14:58] <janieb> was katie the only person they gave something without an antedote to? [14:58] <ltbrave23> i don't think anyone that knew the twins would be their object to experiment on [14:58] <JaneMarple9> and the creeveys yes [14:58] <Raldan> Every year a new crop of students, just wanting to fit in. [14:58] <JaneMarple9> i wish draco had done! [14:58] <Aislinn> It's been a fun chat, everyone! [14:58] <PrincessPickledOnion> oh the possibilites jane [14:58] <fawkes28> Thanks for coming smile [14:58] <Raldan> Yes! [14:58] <Sophia40> Dudley got the the tongue thing [14:58] <MirandaV> Glad I made it in today! [14:58] <TheMadMuggle> thanks for having us [14:59] <PrincessPickledOnion> Thanks fawkes and Aislinn! biggrin [14:59] * JaneMarple9 gets ready for the saturday hug! [14:59] <Raldan> Thanks fawkes! [14:59] <cbm> It was fun! [14:59] <JaneMarple9> ((((everybody)))))) [14:59] <janieb> great converstaion, folks! Thanks! [14:59] <Aislinn> hope to see some of you back again tomorrow for the P3 chat smile [14:59] <PrincessPickledOnion> i like these times better than 3 in the morning smile [14:59] <ltbrave23> bye all!!!! and thanks everyone!!!! [14:59] <PrincessPickledOnion> oh lord yes! whats the topic? [14:59] <JaneMarple9> ((((Mollywobbles))))) too smile [14:59] <cbm> What is the p3 chat about? [14:59] <Sophia40> bye everyone [14:59] <TheMadMuggle> bye everyone...great chatting [14:59] <mollywobbles23> bye! [14:59] *** mollywobbles23 has quit [Bye] [14:59] <Raldan> Thanks everyone and bye! [14:59] *** ltbrave23 left #lounge [] [14:59] *** janieb has quit [Bye] [14:59] <MirandaV> Thanks fawkes and Aislinn...hope to see ya tomorrow at P3.... hug [14:59] *** TheMadMuggle has quit [Bye] [14:59] <Aislinn> The prophecy chapter from the HP7 project [14:59] <JaneMarple9> whats ppp tomorrow? [14:59] <PrincessPickledOnion> Awesome!! biggrin [14:59] <fawkes28> prophecy fun! [14:59] <cbm> cool, bye [15:00] <JaneMarple9> ah sounds good [15:00] *** cbm has quit [Bye] [15:00] <MirandaV> I'll have to read it before tomorrow then, bye! [15:00] <fawkes28> hope to see you all tomorrow! [15:00] <JaneMarple9> got to read it beforehand [15:00] <PrincessPickledOnion> Thanks guys i'm off... got a date with david tennat :drool: [15:00] *** Sophia40 left #lounge [] [15:00] *** MirandaV has quit [Bye] [15:00] <PrincessPickledOnion> XXXXXXXXXXXXXXx [15:00] * JaneMarple9 waves! [15:00] *** Raldan left #lounge [] [15:00] *** JaneMarple9 has quit [Bye] [15:00] <PrincessPickledOnion> Bye jane! [15:00] <Aislinn> bye! This post has been edited by Aislinn: Apr 14 2007, 02:21 PM --------------------  To listen and share great filks, check out Swishandfilk.com New stuff: Nina's Piece of Me, MJ's Return to Forever & my Now We'll See |
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