Transformation of a Lump of Lead into Gold, Your Alchemy Primer |
 May 25 2008, 08:04 AM
Post
#11
|
|
Hitchhiker's Guide of Harry's Alchemical Journeys  Posts: 3,015 Joined: 9:08pm March 20, 2006 Location: In the Alchemy Lab   |
Ginger I am going to come back in later and speak to your question about conjunction, but for now I would like to bring the discussion back to PS/SS and Harry's journey through PS/SS. here are this weeks questions:
Week two: 6. What are the objects and/or people that are symbolic of Dissolution? 7. How is Harry experiencing the fluidity, i.e., the changeable quality of Dissolution? 8. How do we know we are in the Black stage? 9. At what point do you think the third operation of Separation occurs for Harry? 10. What imagery does JKR use to signify this operation? Happy pondering!  
--------------------  Thanks twiddlethosedials! |
 |
 
 
|
|
May 27 2008, 05:29 PM
Post
#12
|
|
Newest Housekeeper at The Leaky Cauldron Posts: 736 Joined: 4:41pm September 14, 2006 Location: looking for lost braincells in the L&S Broom Closet |
OK, I'm basically an alchemy novice, but I've noticed lately how the process of alchemy seems very much like another literary process, that of the hero's journey, which I do know something about, having taught it in my English classes. So I sat here and charted the parallels, and it's kind of amazing! Very quickly, the hero's journey is a pattern found in myth, folktale, religion, classic literature, modern film...well, pretty much anywhere you look! To give everyone a sense of the range, the story of Christ and The Matrix both follow this pattern. Maybe an overview of the hero's journey can help us look at alchemy. In his book The Hero with a Thousand Faces, mythologist Joseph Campbell discusses the hero's journey in great detail. A lot of what I've learned about the pattern comes from this book. I've also used my teaching notes/handouts to help me with my explanation below. To help further clarify at the risk of my sanity (those color codes!!), I've used pink for alchemy, and teal for the hero's journey.
Through the lens of alchemy, Harry is the “prima materia,” the rough material which is eventually transformed. The hero’s journey follows the same process of transformation. The hero is usually not someone who is immediately identifiable as “heroic” -- in fact, s/he is often an outcast, orphan, abused child, or ugly duckling who demonstrates the promise of unusual strength or cleverness, but who has not yet tapped into her/his full power (sounds like “prima materia” to me!). But the potential of that power is immense; in The Hero with a Thousand Faces, Joseph Campbell says that the hero is not “champion of things [which have] become, but of things becoming” - in other words, s/he is a symbol of hope to a society in need of rescue or redemption. But in order to save society, transformation has to take place… The first step in the process is the Call to Adventure, essentially a message to or awakening within the hero, and brings about the hero’s separation from the ordinary world in order to “pursue that flighty temptress, Adventure” (HBP 56, US). Next the hero meets with a Mentor (Alchemist) who supplies the hero with knowledge and confidence, motivating the hero to act. It is essentially a parental role, and like a parent, the mentor often meets with some resistance on the part of the hero. Here is the part which I think corresponds with Calcination: The mentor’s job is alchemical in that s/he helps the hero purge or "burn away” those psychological and spiritual “impurities” which might sidetrack the hero from her/his purpose, which again is the process of transformation. (I’m using HealerOne’s language from her excellent introduction to this thread). To psychologist Carl Jung, the mentor symbolizes ultimate insight. This insight is crucial in helping the hero embrace her/his powers. After crossing the Threshold of the Unknown and descending into an alternate universe, the hero must undergo and succeed at many trials or challenges, and may experience Tempters (people, creatures, psychological forces) which try and lead the hero astray. One common trial is that of losing the Mentor – but the purpose of this is to make the hero stronger. I think early trials/temptations/obstacles may align with Fermentation (Black Stage). The greatest trial is called the Abyss – it is this which readies her/him to attain full power (Distillation?). Here also the hero may experience an actual or symbolic death. As a result of overcoming trials and temptations, our hero undergoes Atonement (Coagulation), the unifying and purifying of the hero’s powers (think of Luke Skywalker’s becoming “at one” with the Force in Star Wars!). The hero becomes the Alchemist (equaling or surpassing the Mentor’s power, bringing about her/his own transformation) and the Philosopher’s Stone: the perfected being. Or, as Joseph Campbell puts it, s/he becomes the “master of two worlds,” uniting opposites: known and unknown, even human and divine. In the final part of the hero’s journey, our hero reaps the rewards of having survived the tests, and achieves what Campbell calls “the freedom to live” – s/he can pass freely between both worlds, transcending personal limitations. S/he returns to society with an Elixir, a magic potion or power, wisdom, or love – with the Elixir, the hero heals a wounded land, or to restore balance to the world. This is kind of similar to the Elixir of Life found in alchemy, which is ultimately what brings about the hero’s transformation into gold, or a pure being. This post has been edited by merrythought: May 27 2008, 05:44 PM -------------------- Summer's lease hath all too short a date... |
|
|
|
 May 27 2008, 07:35 PM
Post
#13
|
|
Official Grandmother at the Lily and Stag Inn Posts: 2,856 Joined: 4:33pm February 27, 2007 Location: Having tea with Minerva McGonagall at Hogwarts |
Thank you, merrythought for offering this comparison. I am really struggling with alchemy, but the hero's journey is very familiar. Maybe it will help me to understand alchemy a little better.
HealerOne I have a question for you. Is it true that in each Harry Potter book, Harry undergoes the whole journey but at a different level? I thought that I had read this somewhere, but then I have a very active imagination and could have just made it up. --------------------  Thank you, Gilleyweed!!! |
|
|
|
|
May 27 2008, 09:56 PM
Post
#14
|
|
|
Hitchhiker's Guide of Harry's Alchemical Journeys Posts: 3,015 Joined: 9:08pm March 20, 2006 Location: In the Alchemy Lab |
merrythought thank you for your very wonderful post! I am not as familar with the hero's journey but like alchemy, both are as 'old as the hills' and most likely came from similar beginnings! Alchemy, goes back to ancient Egypt - and has a history of about 2500 years. It dates back to the Emerald Tablets dating back to 800 AD. Alchemy has been found to be practiced in Mesopotamia, Ancient Egypt, Persia, India, Japan, Korea and China, in Classical Greece and Rome, in the Muslim civilizations, and then Europe. Of course we know hero stories date back Greek mythology. So it does not surprise me that there is so much in common between them!
Granjo Granger, your question about the alchemical journey within each of the Potter books was one of the things I would like to speak to! Alchemy was the process of purification and the whole 7 operations were repeated until the ultimate purification occurred. During each book one area of Harry's necessary 'purification' is addressed. As I explained in an earlier post - in PS/SS Harry's 'Muggleness' is burned away and he discovers who he is. The 'lump' that is Harry, as we see in the first few chapters, is transformed over the course of the first book. After the burning trials he undergoes in the book, his inner 'star' is released so that DD and the rest of his mates see the potential this untrained wizard has. This purification continues in the next 4 books, until he becomes free of the impurities of his soul and can receive his 'spirit' and be united into a new being. I would now like to turn to Dissolution again. I came across a quote in one of the Alchemy text I am studying. I thought it might be helpful for all of you that are confused about the whole Alchemical journey and specifically dissolution. This is from On Becoming an Alchemist: A Guide for the Modern Magician by Catherine MacCoun (Page 164-165): “Some Scholars regard the transmutation of lead into gold as a metaphor for the transformation of the self. The gold, they say, is you when you become fully realized or enlightened. But according to traditional procedure there are actually two transformations. First you make a philosopher’s stone, then you use it to transmute base metal. The first step – the forming of the stone – is the transformation of the self. The second step is the transforming of something that is not the self. The gold isn’t you. It’s something outside of you that you desire. The philosopher’s stone is a means, not an end. In fact, if you don’t want to use it for something, you won’t be able to form it. You can’t succeed with the alchemical transformation of the self unless you desire something that is not yourself. Wanting gold is vainglorious.” “Desire melts us (snip). We need this melting, because the fire of calcination leaves us parched. (Snip) If calcination were the only inner process available to us, we would meet every setback with courage and equanimity, yet our lives would be dull and gray as ashes. No vine can flower if you try to grow it in ashes alone. Fruitful soil is damp.” “The Process of dissolution happens in the gap between desire and it’s attainment.” I hope that was helpful in explaining more what the journey of ALchemy is about and specifically what Dissolution is. ________________________________________________________________________________ _______ So now that brings us back to the questions for this week! I'd like to speak to this question - 6. What are the objects/people that are symbolic of Dissolution? Here's some which I have gathered in several different texts on Alchemy - Tin, Jupiter, Thursday, white or light blue (ashes), the black crow (specifically looking at it's reflection in water), tears, floods, melting, water spraying from the earth, plants blooming, the King swimming in water, dark dragons, the Basilisk, the Green Lion, yearnings, disappointments, irritability, cynicism, dreams, voices, visions and strange feelings, desires, longings, fervor, water and air! Whew!!! Do you recognize any of these symbols within the text of PS/SS? Are there any people in the text that might be considered one of these symbols? -------------------- Thanks twiddlethosedials! |
|
|
|
|
May 29 2008, 07:51 PM
Post
#15
|
|
|
Sundae-Nut-Chopper at Florean Fortescue's Posts: 948 Joined: 12:30am December 18, 2006 |
So...I am a total newbie when it comes to all this Alchemy stuff! Just so y'all know, I'm using this thread as my "coach"
 . I've been mulling over just the introductory information, so I'm going to add my thoughts about a couple of the first questions--I am so sorry to interrupt the flow... QUOTE(HealerOne @ May 12 2008, 09:23 PM)  3. Considering the differences of the metallurgic, spiritual, and psychological views of calcination, what needs to be burned away, i.e., what psychological baggage, spiritual impurities, or characteristics of lead need to be 'fired away' in order to allow change? Just to make sure I'm understanding some of the posts so far: There are some readers who consider that Harry goes through the alchemical process in every book, some readers who feel that each book represents a step in the process that occurs over the series, and (maybe?) some readers who consider both options to be true. If I've got that right, then I would definitely fall into the last group of readers; from my limited understanding, I can absolutely see minor transformations (or is it transmutations?) occuring in each book, as well as a major one across the septology.4. What parts of Harry must be “burned away” to make him amenable for the changes to come? From the first perspective, then, as far as calcination in PS/SS, I think that Harry would need to "burn away" or shed his psychological baggage related to his ideas of himself (who he is, how he compares to others), his ideas of adults (based on his Dursley guardians, his teachers who have ignored him), and his ideas of "how things work" in the Muggle world (what is energy, what is unchangeable, what properties different things hold). An example of an idea of himself that would need to be burned away might be the feeling that he is not special, that he is unexceptional--in other words, Harry needs to come to see himself as different from what he's thought himself to be, in an exceptional way. An example of his ideas about adults would be that they don't pay attention to someone as unspecial as himself or that they're not very helpful or kind--but in order to be able to trust Hagrid and his teachers at Hogwarts, he has to let go of those preconceptions. An example of "how things work" in the Muggle world would be that brooms are for sweeping, owls are just birds, humans can't become an animal, etc. All of these preconceptions need to be shed, in order to prepare him to assimilate (somewhat  ) into the wizarding world.BUT...I think it's very important that though such things change form, they are still around (in ash form) for the next step. I think that Harry benefitted tremendously from growing up in the Muggle world, in a lot of ways, and from having had a bit of an awakening into his special-ness, that wizard-raised children might take for granted or never fully realize. Calcination, then, really is a way to take some things that might be generally negative, and using them for good, positive outcomes, I think. Now, over the course of the series as a whole, I would say that Harry needs to burn away some immaturity, some early notions of right/wrong/good/bad, and perhaps, some of his innocence--in order to fulfill what he chose as his duties to the wizarding world.  So there's my stab at putting Alchemy into a framework that I can access a bit more readily--hopefully I'm somewhere close to getting it, a bit?  (And if I'm not, please, let me know! I really want to get this Alchemy stuff figured out--if it was important to JKR, I can only imagine that it will deepen my understanding and enjoyment of the series, right?)
-------------------- "...the world isn't split into good people and Death Eaters" - Sirius Black (OOTP14)
|
|
|
|
|
May 29 2008, 08:22 PM
Post
#16
|
|
|
Newest Housekeeper at The Leaky Cauldron Posts: 736 Joined: 4:41pm September 14, 2006 Location: looking for lost braincells in the L&S Broom Closet |
QUOTE(HealerOne @ May 27 2008, 10:56 PM) “Some Scholars regard the transmutation of lead into gold as a metaphor for the transformation of the self. The gold, they say, is you when you become fully realized or enlightened. But according to traditional procedure there are actually two transformations. First you make a philosopher’s stone, then you use it to transmute base metal. The first step – the forming of the stone – is the transformation of the self. The second step is the transforming of something that is not the self. The gold isn’t you. It’s something outside of you that you desire. The philosopher’s stone is a means, not an end. In fact, if you don’t want to use it for something, you won’t be able to form it. You can’t succeed with the alchemical transformation of the self unless you desire something that is not yourself. Wanting gold is vainglorious.” That quoting really helps me, HealerOne. I always saw the "gold" as a kind of spiritual achievement (or enlightenment) which is unique to the hero/alchemist; but these passages actually connect back to what I had said about the hero's journey: the whole point of the journey/transformation is a selfless one. In the novel we see this made manifest when Harry stands before the Mirror and recieves the Stone despite his lack of desire to possess it. QUOTE(StepInTime @ May 29 2008, 08:51 PM) There are some readers who consider that Harry goes through the alchemical process in every book, some readers who feel that each book represents a step in the process that occurs over the series, and (maybe?) some readers who consider both options to be true. If I've got that right, then I would definitely fall into the last group of readers; from my limited understanding, I can absolutely see minor transformations (or is it transmutations?) occuring in each book, as well as a major one across the septology. I think I'm with you, StepInTime; each novel is like a microcosm of the alchemy theme which spans the whole series. Harry's developments in each book are all part of the ultimate transformation which makes him ready for the final challenge with Voldemort. QUOTE(StepInTime @ May 29 2008, 08:51 PM) ...I think it's very important that though such things change form, they are still around (in ash form) for the next step. I think that Harry benefitted tremendously from growing up in the Muggle world, in a lot of ways, and from having had a bit of an awakening into his special-ness, that wizard-raised children might take for granted or never fully realize. Calcination, then, really is a way to take some things that might be generally negative, and using them for good, positive outcomes, I think. I totally agree. Out of the ashes, something new is born (to draw on phoenix imagery). Out of pain comes some peace, or reconciliation, or understanding. Another possible aspect of calcination in PS/SS seems to be Harry's learning the truth about his parents: although he never knew much, what he thought he knew has been "burnt away," preparing him to reconnect with his parents and to understand why they died. It is this which guides his choice to fight Voldemort all the way. -------------------- Summer's lease hath all too short a date... |
|
|
|
|
May 29 2008, 10:24 PM
Post
#17
|
|
|
Hitchhiker's Guide of Harry's Alchemical Journeys Posts: 3,015 Joined: 9:08pm March 20, 2006 Location: In the Alchemy Lab |
QUOTE(StepInTime @ May 29 2008, 07:51 PM) So...I am a total newbie when it comes to all this Alchemy stuff! Just so y'all know, I'm using this thread as my "coach" . BUT...I think it's very important that though such things change form, they are still around (in ash form) for the next step. I think that Harry benefitted tremendously from growing up in the Muggle world, in a lot of ways, and from having had a bit of an awakening into his special-ness, that wizard-raised children might take for granted or never fully realize. Calcination, then, really is a way to take some things that might be generally negative, and using them for good, positive outcomes, I think. (And if I'm not, please, let me know! I really want to get this Alchemy stuff figured out--if it was important to JKR, I can only imagine that it will deepen my understanding and enjoyment of the series, right?)  That's what this Alchemy thread is about - teaching those of you that haven't dipped your toe into Alchemy to get the basics of what it's about! And StepInTime, you are doing just fine. Remember there is no right or wrong here. We are finding our way all together! Some of what you say works very well with Alchemy. What is in the ashes is the very essence of the Primia Material. But what is there has to be purified repeatedly to get that person to be in a state that can accept the combining of the spirit and soul - in the very spiritual white stage of the process. In relationship to Harry, all those experiences that he had in the Muggle world and specifically with the Dursleys must be reconciled within his psyche, accepted as part of him, but not be so much of a block that he is unable to move forward from those experiences. The fact that bad things happen to Harry at the Dursleys cannot be changed, but what Harry does do is choose how he deals with those experiences. He begins to put them into perspective and not allow the experiences to to taint him. As you will probably agree this process isn't totally complete in PS/SS, Harry has to deal with his memories of the Dursleys -especially Aunt Petunia, all the way up to nearly the end of the series. But each time he goes through this process it becomes more complete and it it easier for him to get through. The same could be said of each operation in the 7 steps. Just a note about the process of calcination and the spiritual and psychological outcome of this operation. One of the very important outcomes of calcination is uncovering what is our true essence: and when we do, that we gain self-confidence. If there is one thing that Harry learned from the whole PS/SS experience, I think, it was confidence. He is a different child when he steps off that Hogwarts returning train. He has a much better handle on who he is and what his capabilities are. QUOTE(merrythought @ May 29 2008, 08:22 PM) That quoting really helps me, HealerOne. I always saw the "gold" as a kind of spiritual achievement (or enlightenment) which is unique to the hero/alchemist; but these passages actually connect back to what I had said about the hero's journey: the whole point of the journey/transformation is a selfless one. In the novel we see this made manifest when Harry stands before the Mirror and recieves the Stone despite his lack of desire to possess it. Yes! The mirror scene is really telling that this is about Alchemy! Harry's heart's desire is to possess the stone to save it from usage by evil. He is able to receive the Stone, because it is a selfless act. (Just as in DH he is able to live because he willingly gave himself as a sacrifice to die at Voldemort's hand.) Voldemort was never pure enough to receive the stone, he in no way has taken the purification route, in fact some have theorized that Voldemort was a "reverse alchemist". Instead of purifiying his body and soul, he was ripping apart his soul and defiling his body. QUOTE(merrythought @ May 29 2008, 08:22 PM) I think I'm with you, StepInTime; each novel is like a microcosm of the alchemy theme which spans the whole series. Harry's developments in each book are all part of the ultimate transformation which makes him ready for the final challenge with Voldemort. Out of the ashes, something new is born (to draw on phoenix imagery). Out of pain comes some peace, or reconciliation, or understanding. Another possible aspect of calcination in PS/SS seems to be Harry's learning the truth about his parents: although he never knew much, what he thought he knew has been "burnt away," preparing him to reconnect with his parents and to understand why they died. It is this which guides his choice to fight Voldemort all the way. First I think you are very much on track about how Harry must uncover the truth about his parents and that he is being prepared to reconnect with them (starting in POA) Again he must be able to integrate all of this into his psyche in order to be able to move forward and in those closing scenes of DH be able to call forth his parents, not selfishly, but for them to fetch him and give him the courage to do his ultimate sacrifice. His love for his parents, their sacrifice for him and ultimately their love for him is what sets him apart from Voldemort (as DD keeps telling him!). That desire to remain within their love and to change himself into the kind of person that can love in this manner is surely the engine that drives Harry. As to your last statement, I agree with you on all of that, too. I see each book as an alchemical journey, but I also see the whole series as the entire process that brings Harry into the highly purified state so that he can complete the process of 'making gold' for the wizarding world! -------------------- Thanks twiddlethosedials! |
|
|
|
|
May 30 2008, 09:11 AM
Post
#18
|
|
|
Official Grandmother at the Lily and Stag Inn Posts: 2,856 Joined: 4:33pm February 27, 2007 Location: Having tea with Minerva McGonagall at Hogwarts |
As I read all of the preceding posts, I find myself nodding in agreement and beginning to to take all of this in. Like SIT, I need to go back to calcination just to be able to articulate something. Harry had to rid himself of all his misconceptions, his old identity if you will. He is not who he thought he was, and he needs to become comfortable in his real identity. This becoming would begin with dissolution. He can grow now that the ashes are wet. He starts understanding who he is. As this becomes consistent with what he is able to do easily, he gains self confidence.
My thoughts on dissolution will not be orderly, but I will not be reticent. 1.So much water surrounding Hagrid's coming to rescue Harry and force the change. 2.The dream that first night at Hogwarts was a vision. 3. Harry longs not to be in Slytherin because what he knows about it goes against his values. 4. If Slytherin represents power, then Harry does not want power in the stone. 5. Hagrid is Harry's guide, even the catalyst as the dissolution takes place. 6. Even though DD is the overall alchemist, it looks to me as though Hagrid could be seen in this role for this book only. He is the adult to whom Harry relates well and often, and Hagrid's doings propel the action.In hindsight, 7. I see Snape as the green lion. His in Slytherin House, but he has the courage of a Lion and is protectiong a lion. 8. Thursday is Thor's day. Thor is the god of war. the war between good and evil tales place in every book. In this one , it is over the "Stone"This theme begins in Gringotts when Harry sees the package and ends when Harry sees the stone in the mirror if errised in his own pocket, and he defeats Quirrell-mort. The stone is safe foe DD to return to Flamel. 9. The black crow looking at his reflection in this book would be quirrell and Voldemort looking at their reflection in the Mirror of Errised at the end of the tasks. 10. In this book, the dark dragon is Norbert the Norwegian Ridgeback, Hagrid's baby dragon. The trio work rogether to get the little dragon to safety once he is seen. It is an important co'operative task, good training for the trapdoor. 11. Air comes in when Harry discovers he is a natural on a broom, and thanks to Professor McGonagall bomes the seeker on the Gryffindor Quidditch Team. Harry will need to be as comfortable in the air as he is on the ground and in the water(later). I editted it to add seven more points., (By Jo! I think she's got it! Sorry to fan but in here to fix tags.) This post has been edited by Granjo Granger: Jun 8 2008, 11:52 AM -------------------- Thank you, Gilleyweed!!! |
|
|
|
|
May 31 2008, 10:34 PM
Post
#19
|
|
|
Hitchhiker's Guide of Harry's Alchemical Journeys Posts: 3,015 Joined: 9:08pm March 20, 2006 Location: In the Alchemy Lab |
QUOTE(Granjo Granger @ May 30 2008, 09:11 AM) My thoughts on dissolution will not be orderly, but I will not be reticent. 1.So much water surrounding Hagrid's coming to rescue Harry and force the change. 2.The dream that first night at Hogwarts was a vision. 3. Harry longs not to be in Slytherin because what he knows about it goes against his values. 4. If Slytherin represents power, then Harry does not want power in the stone. 5. Hagrid is Harry's guide, even the catalyst as the dissolution takes place. 6. Even though DD is the overall alchemist, it looks to me as though Hagrid could be seen in this role for this book only. He is the adult to whom Harry relates well and often, and Hagrid's doings propel the action.In hindsight, 7. I see Snape as the green lion. His in Slytherin House, but he has the courage of a Lion and is protectiong a lion. 8. Thursday is Thor's day. Thor is the god of war. the war between good and evil tales place in every book. In this one , it is over the "Stone"This theme begins in Gringotts when Harry sees the package and ends when Harry sees the stone in the mirror if errised in his own pocket, and he defeats Quirrell-mort. The stone is safe foe DD to return to Flamel. 9. The black crow looking at his reflection in this book would be quirrell and Voldemort looking at their reflection in the Mirror of Errised at the end of the tasks. 10. In this book, the dark dragon is Norbert the Hungarian Horntail., Hagrid's baby dragon. The trio work rogether to get the little dragon to safety once he is seen. It is an important co'operative task, good training for the trapdoor. 11. Air comes in when Harry discovers he is a natural on a broom, and thanks to Professor McGonagall bomes the seeker on the Gryffindor Quidditch Team. Harry will need to be as comfortable in the air as he is on the ground and in the water(later). Granjo I'm just going to comment on your great post by numbers! 2. Funny you should mention that dream. It most definitely is a vision of what is going on. Harry's unconscious portion of his mind is telling him some important details. But notice that Harry rolled over and forgot the dream by the next morning. He's not quite ready yet to face his unconscious self. At this point his rational brain is rejecting the unconscious mind's clues to what is going on. 5. and 7. It's interesting that you consider Hagrid a catalyst in Harry's journey. Most of the HP related things I have read, target Snape as the catalyst - Vitriol, or as you correctly stated, the Green Lion (named as such because of the greenish cast of the greasy substance). Vitriol is a biting, corrosive acid, (sulfuric acid) that destroys most everything but gold. The Alchemists considered it a liquid fire. The thing about a catalyst is that it remains unchanged even though the substance it is applied to changes. Hagrid, to me, does change through out the series. Even though his heart remains the same, Hagrid becomes more and more attached to the Trio and especially to Harry. Vitrol cannot attach itself to the substance it is changing. Snape seems the epitome of Vitriol - aggressive, biting and unchanging. He very much so drives the changes that occur with Harry. I like the idea of Hagrid as a guide through the process - a support system for Harry. 6. The one thing which I always had trouble with (before DH) was how Dumbledore stood outside the action and watched Harry get into terrible trouble and didn't interfere. That made me crazy to think a teacher and a responsible adult like this great wizard would be putting this child in danger, on purpose! Even though Hagrid is more readily seen in this book, it's clear to me that Dumbledore was calling the shots, as to how much Harry was exposed to, in order for him to be ready if Voldemort should show up to mess with him. Hagrid actually interacts in this process, while Dumbledore just sets the 'experiment up' and observes Harry's reaction to the experiment. He only intercedes when Harry is in mortal danger. I do consider Dumbledore the Alchemist and Harry the Primia Material, but because what Dumbleore is experimenting with is a person, I am beginning to believe that Harry becomes the apprentice of Dumbledore as the process continues. Anyone else want to weigh in on that? 9. I love that analogy of the two faced man looking at their reflections! Excellent catch! 11. Absolutely! The ultimate of separation is when Harry gets on his broom and takes off from the earth (the below) for the skies (the above). He separates himself from the earth by air. He isn't, by any means a perfect flier at this point, but the possibilities that he will learn the nuances of the Seeker position is there. In other words, he still needs to purify himself more before he will be truly a great flier. This purification will come through trials and tribulations that will further agitate out the impurities of his personality. Just to help you out to figure out separation - the third operation ... here are some of the images connected with it: Mars, iron, 2 white birds ascending into the heaven from the black earth (signifying the ashes from both calcination and dissolution from the blackness of the primia material), the spirit rising, winds, filters, piles of sand (to filter liquids), knights wielding swords, the caduceus as a weapon, divorce, dismemberment, surgery, splitting of the Red Sea, breaking apart of Heaven and Earth, dividing, cutting or breaking down of substances. So now that I have you all primed for Separation, here are this weeks questions: Week Three: 11. What does Harry have to separate out of his life to be amenable to continuing to the next operation and why? 12. What is the importance of separation through out the book and how does it bring forth another stage of alchemy? 13. What imagery or symbols stand out in these chapters as being alchemical? This post has been edited by HealerOne: Jun 1 2008, 07:50 AM -------------------- Thanks twiddlethosedials! |
|
|
|
|
Jun 1 2008, 09:37 AM
Post
#20
|
|
|
Newest Housekeeper at The Leaky Cauldron Posts: 736 Joined: 4:41pm September 14, 2006 Location: looking for lost braincells in the L&S Broom Closet |
QUOTE(HealerOne @ May 31 2008, 11:34 PM) 11. What does Harry have to separate out of his life to be amenable to continuing to the next operation and why? 12. What is the importance of separation through out the book and how does it bring forth another stage of alchemy? 13. What imagery or symbols stand out in these chapters as being alchemical? My first thought is that Harry has to separate out fears of inadequacy. On the train, he admits this fear to Ron with, "I bet I'm the worst in the class." Later, faced with the unknown "test" just before the feast, he feels completely and understandably unprepared; he regards the moment as "his doom." This continues well beyond our current chapters. He also has to separate out his former identity as the disregarded, unwanted boy. His fame confronts him wherever he goes now: "Potter, did she say?" "The Harry Potter?" It's not an easy adjustment; "dazed," he barely knows what it all means. I imagine too he might feel as though he barely knows himself anymore: he's so worried about being placed in Slytherin that he silently begs not to be. He has only a faint understanding of what it means to be a Slytherin, but he knows it's not good, and he seems to worry that there's some of that nastiness within himself. My, HealerOne, that is some list of separation imagery! Dividing and dismemberment were the two which called out to me. The Sorting is a division of the students into their houses (although, overall in chapter 7 I feel more sense of the students coming together as one student body - the first years, at least). As for dismemberment, there's Nearly Headless Nick. Not to mention a seat the twins threaten to sever from an innocent toilet (I'm joking  ).QUOTE(Granjo Granger @ May 30 2008, 09:11 AM) 5. Hagrid is Harry's guide, even the catalyst as the dissolution takes place. 6. Even though DD is the overall alchemist, it looks to me as though Hagrid could be seen in this role for this book only. He is the adult to whom Harry relates well and often, and Hagrid's doings propel the action. If I can squeeze in a little more about the hero's journey...in this pattern Hagrid can be seen as the Herald, a character who signals massive change in the life of the hero, and who issues the Call to Adventure. It is around this time that the hero finds allies and enemies who will play important roles along the journey: Hagrid is Harry's first ally. Between Diagon Alley and the banquet at Hogwarts more allies are found - the Weasleys, Neville, and Hermione, as well as enemies - Draco, Goyle, Crabbe, Snape. -------------------- Summer's lease hath all too short a date... |
|
|
|
